What do you guys think—

Quick recap:
We've been talking to each other for about 3 mths...
Went out on a date...
Things got awkward...
Things got back to normal...

After things got awkward I decided to back off...

At first, when I thought he lived on his own...I just wondered why he wouldn't take me out and stuff...

Now that I KNOW he still lives with his parents it makes sense why he stopped things dry!

Our walk to the mountain didn't commit him to anything..there was no way we would have had to drop by his place after...not like after a dinner date or something similar...anyways!

Funny enough he has started telling me a bit more about his past times...He tells me about his family gatherings, what he did for his mom's bday...restaurants he would strongly recommend...or random stuff such as the fact that he went to buy razor blades on the week-end...it's as if I would mention that I had bought Deo or Wax...so endearing!!!!

Anyhow...I am letting him go and will see where it takes me...I am not in a hurry...but he is 38 and still lives at his parents's gigantic house (mansion style ). Both his brother and sister are married and have kids.

****

Today I saw him at the gym...and we got to talking and than I blabbed something like: You must think this girl always has crazy stuff happening to her...lol

and he said something along: No no...I find you interesting...it's just that I'm not interesting.

At the end of his workout he came to see me and asked me if I was almost done...I was like yeah but I've gotta stretch...and then he said: ok...catch you later!

****
So short recap:

He is Chinese, born in Canada, 38 yrs old, Libra with Cancer or Gemini moon.
He is single (100% )
He lives with his parents (Who go to China pretty often through the year)
He claims that he doesn't take his workouts too seriously...mehhh I don't really buy that.


I am canadian, 24yrs old, scorpio with saggi moon.

If you like him tell him. His comment of "No no...I find you interesting...it's just that I'm not interesting." is his insecurity talking. I remember mentioning before that he sounded insecure when he stood around waiting for you when you were talking to someone. Him saying that he isn't interesting was him fishing for a compliment. We love to be complimented. We want to be chased and adored. Nothing stalkerish but some kind of affirmation.

Don't read to much into things he says casually like his buying razor blades. I don't think he was looking for a specific response. We tend to talk about whatever is going on. We are generally pretty much an open book.

You still need to get him out of the gym again to see what's up.

I just saw the message you sent me but couldn't respond to it, I kept getting some weird mail error.

There was a section in the email that isn't on the thread though and I wanted to comment on it...

You said:
One thing he does which I don't know how to understand: he'll say I went to this restaurant it was amazing, he'll tell me which meal he ordered with the most details, I mean like every ingredient...and then he'll ask me if I like that type of food and suggest that I should go because it is the best ever...

Response:
Tell him you would love to try the restaurant WITH HIM. Libras are famous for dropping hints and trying to get you to make the move. He may be afraid to ask you to go with him, many of us have deep fears of rejection. So, rather that ask you directly, he mentions a date idea and waits for you to ask him to take you. It gets him the same outcome but it eliminates the chance that he asks and you say no.

@Librasid...

Ahhhh Librasid...you just made my day...once more thank you for replying! It means a lot...

About the restaurant thing...I thought so but then I was like maybe that's not what he meant...maybe he was just giving me a recommendation...but I'll certainly take your advice on this one and next time I'll jump right in and ask him if he would like to go with me!!!

Yeah I guess he really struggles finding things interesting to say...when he does have something relevant he comes straight to me and tells me about it in the smallest details...

I am really crushing on him...he is such a sweet bean!!!! 🙂

yeah, definitely don't read too deep into anything a libra tells you. even a 38 year old man will talk about himself like a 12 year old girl who just drank 3 redbulls if he's a libra.

him coming to tell you things doesn't mean he likes you (or that he doesn't). it just means you'll listen, so he goes to the person who'll listen. as much as libras like talking about ourselves, we hate blabbing to people who don't want to hear it. it's one of the flavors of rejection. we go to the person who listens to us with big eyes, like everything we tell them is the most interesting thing they've ever heard.

the thing is, he doesn't feel too great about himself. and he doesn't really have any reason why he should. he lives at home and doesn't have anything interesting to talk about. how can you flatter somebody who knows there's nothing great about himself. that's a tough situation.

libra manipulation technique:
if you like him, make your interest clear and obvious. ask him out. grab his hand. give him a peck on the cheek, then a big smile. whatever. if he doesn't respond the way you want him to, cut off communication. you can say hi, but you've suddently gotten cold, you aren't excited to see him anymore, and you're in a hurry. not in a rude way. you are only interested in dating him, not in being friends, sorry. provided you are physically attractive to him, he will miss your attention and change his mind. now you call the shots.

you have to be committed to the 'not interested in just friends' thing, though. this has to be your honest response to the situation. it won't work otherwise.

Posted by curious visitor

libra manipulation technique:
if you like him, make your interest clear and obvious. ask him out. grab his hand. give him a peck on the cheek, then a big smile. whatever. if he doesn't respond the way you want him to, cut off communication. you can say hi, but you've suddently gotten cold, you aren't excited to see him anymore, and you're in a hurry. not in a rude way. you are only interested in dating him, not in being friends, sorry. provided you are physically attractive to him, he will miss your attention and change his mind. now you call the shots.

you have to be committed to the 'not interested in just friends' thing, though. this has to be your honest response to the situation. it won't work otherwise.

Traitor!

Yeah that would do it for me.

Really...woahhh those are some serious mind games...I am not sure I want to get into this.

Relationships as they are, are already complicated enough!!! Why add more complexities to them!?

I am down with "being straightforward" with him and stuff...but then again...fear of rejection is a killer.

I have to admit something to you guys...

Posted by ScorpSage

I have to admit something to you guys...

Well, confess already! =)

@ librasid: lol
This is hard...because I don't tend to run around and brag about it...

I don't know what it is with me...I am ok looking...have always seemed to attract guys but never understood why...and in a protection way...I have always denied the attraction and always managed to find something bad about them...in the sense that I would find a "non-sense flaw" about them just to get disgusted and move on without looking back or going any further...This being said I have lost and wasted so many opportunities to be with great guys just because of my insecurities.

The thing is that...now...at 24yrs old...I have never ever been in a relationship...no making out, no holding hands and obviously no sex...yeah I am a virgin!! Huh!

Something I didn't share with you guys was that the time we went on our date/walk...it was a first meeting...and being my old inexperienced self, I was very tensed and very radical on what I wanted and on what I didn't want from a prospect.
I mean this discussion wasn't the main subject, but one thing led to another and we ended up talking about that...actually I gave my POV on that matter. Explaining him how I wasn't the type of girl to sleep around and that in my culture the day I'd move out of my parents place was because I was going to get married...anyways I was just trying to paint a portrait of where I came from and what I was looking for...I mean this wasn't in regards to him and I...but simply in the frame of a discussion about cultural differences...ect!

Now during our walk he would at times pull me aside (by the waist) so that I didn't walk in a hole or over horse shit...the thing is that I always so those things coming...I mean it wasn't as if I wasn't paying attention to where I was headed...

I mean for a regular girl being held around the waist wouldn't mean anything...but in my case...I wasn't used to ever being touched by a guy....ESPECIALLY not with his hands around my waist...and instead of saying thanks to him...I just looked at him and said YOU'RE FUNNY...of course I didn't think he was funny...I thought he was sweet...but couldn't grasp the thought of saying that...I was so stressed out and anxious by what had just happened that I didn't controlled what was coming out of my mouth...

And then I couldn't get myself to rub elbows with him...I was quite distant...we were walking side by side at approx. an arm's length between us.

And at the end...I just said: well that was fun...we should do this again...and stood there immobilized by what could happen next...I guess the tension in my body was quite visible as he simply reached over and shook my hand!

I remember when I asked him if he wanted to go for a walk at the mountain..for half a second I was strong enough and then I started crumbling through the tension..I remember saying that I could give him my # so that he could let me know if he wanted to cancel...he didn't have his cell on him...but made sure to go fetch a pencil and a paper.

So that you see where I am coming from...I mean this guy is great! He is respectful, polite, easygoing and that is probably why I feel like he could be a great match for me...and the truth is that I wouldn't mind losing my virginity to him...I mean all that talk about waiting about marriage...I still care about companionship...but if I do think I've found the right guy I do not need to get married or anything to go out with him, have fun and have sex...why not! And now I feel that I went on and ruined everything by showing this very uptight personna of mine. I feel like all I have done with that was scare him away...and now I am paddling very hard to get him back to me and show him that I wouldn't mind being with him even if it's not a serious relationship...I would just want him to know that I'd like to go with the flow...and get to know him better and see if we could make it work!? But how can I even approach him on that topic if I can't even manage ask him to try a restaurant with me...

I mean don't get me wrong...as if I haven't said enough...I am so very into him but I just can't help it...I get so so anxious around him like there is no tomorrow. I get OCD.....I stutter...I blush and I can't hear well..lol...I should be screened for that show on A&E..."obsessed" lollllz!!!


There you go Librasid...hopefully that will give you a better idea as to where I come from and why I am so relationship-handicapped!!!!

I had a long response typed up but I am not sure about a few things that I would need to clarify before I am comfortable with an answer.

First, are you willing to give someone a chance now and not seek flaws that you can use against them? This is important because it show major insecurity on your part. You are afraid of being hurt in a relationship so rather than "risk it" you destroy it before it starts. If you don't take the time to identify why you developed this behavior it could (has?) turn into a self destructive pattern.

Second, I can't quite gauge how YOU feel about your being a virgin. It can be difficult to convey meaning of sensitive information through written word because we don't see your face or hear your voice when you say it. Are you proud of it? Embarrassed? Indifferent? Did it just never happen or was it avoided for "saving yourself". You mentioned culture and beliefs, does this fall into that category?


There are just so many ways that these questions can effect how you proceed. Regardless, it is a unique situation. You are not used to touch, affection, relationships and Libras are terrified of rejection. Your "negative" response to him touching you would have caused him to hit the brakes. Negative in his mind, not in solid right and wrong terms. That is why things slowed after your walk, he felt rejected. The fact that you are still pursuing him after confuses him. I think it is good that you let him know you have different standards and expectations up front it may help his confusion but it will not alleviate it. It is a touchy subject (pun intended)...

I hadn't read the second post when I responded. His "shaking your hand" shows that he felt rejected. He knew you were uncomfortable with his touch otherwise he would have hugged you. Most of us are huggers =)

I cannot advise you on this part:
"So that you see where I am coming from...I mean this guy is great! He is respectful, polite, easygoing and that is probably why I feel like he could be a great match for me...and the truth is that I wouldn't mind losing my virginity to him...I mean all that talk about waiting about marriage...I still care about companionship...but if I do think I've found the right guy I do not need to get married or anything to go out with him, have fun and have sex...why not!"

That is personal choice. In the other response I put up I questioned your thoughts on it but more so that you could think about your personal "Why or why not". There is no right or wrong answer here. It is what you are comfortable with. Don't be pressured into anything because of a "why not" attitude, on the other hand, don't be afraid to do something because someone else said it was right or wrong.

I don't think you have ruined anything by showing an uptight side. You may have made it more challenging but your have not ruined a relationship with a Libra until they refuse to speak to you. When he is "done" or "gives up", he will avoid you at all costs.

You need to come to terms with yourself. What do you want? Why do you think you are "relationship-handicapped"? What are your limits?

@Librasid

"First, are you willing to give someone a chance now and not seek flaws that you can use against them?"

I don't know...I freaked out a bit when he gave me so much attention like before we had the walk and during the walk.
I can only say...that the fact that we have been getting to know each other has helped a lot.

"You are afraid of being hurt in a relationship so rather than "risk it" you destroy it before it starts."

Right on...I am afraid that the person will find me gross or unattractive...I mean I know for a fact that I am good looking and always clean and presentable...it's just a scare that I have...a "what if" type of scare!

"Second, I can't quite gauge how YOU feel about your being a virgin."
Well in my culture...I am berber (very similar to the arabic culture)...virginity was and is still considered a virtue even more so now because not too many girls have kept it until marriage!

"Did it just never happen or was it avoided for "saving yourself"."
At first, in my earlier years...like 15 to 18...I didn't really even think of sex...than 18-22...I started thinking to myself that if I had kept it that long...I might as well wait for "the one" who I'll get married to...and now the past year or so..I have been thinking to myself that being a virgin shouldn't have to define me...but I just feel that now it has become an obstacle because I feel chained to the "virgin title"...how do you come off to a guy...saying "btw I am still a virgin"...you know what I mean...now it is much more of a crippling thing than anything else!

"You are not used to touch, affection, relationships"
Indeed...for example: when he is done with his work-out he comes to see me and say bye and then he fist bumps me...and at first it was so weird getting use to even that...I mean now..I can allow myself to be slightly closer to him and not freak out but that's about it..if at some point he'd come behind me and pat me on the shoulder I would freak out for a second because I wouldn't have expected that! This is how bad the situation is!!! Yeah...And the walk..I know I was just terrible...but I did ask him to go grab a bite a week or so after...and it wasn't really after the walk that things got awkward but rather after I asked him to go grab a bite. I mean he hadn't said no but he hadn't said yes either.

"The fact that you are still pursuing him after confuses him"
You might be right...but all I know is that I am working very hard at fixing my

mistakes...

I've paid the highest price for it...but it is still very hard to get everything back on track...

I use to think that it was because of my relationship with my dad...but no not really, I mean my dad isn't perfect and our trust relationship isn't the best...but it was just an excuse for me...I mean my dad has always been the most irresponsible man but one thing he has also always been is....very loving and very kind...so yeah!

I think I should actually partially blame my too overly present mom...she is very old fashioned in the way she acts..very prude like..and very pessimistic...I mean don't think I am nearly as pessimistic as her...I try to run away from that...and I would say that's where we clash...I tend to be independent and optimistic but she always brings me down

When I tell her about a guy...because things never worked in the past, she always says we'll see when it will happen because you always run away...

My mom is very insecure and not aware of how beautiful she is...a lot of people comment on how beautiful she is..I mean my friends, her friends, strangers, my dad's friends..ect.

Getting to know each other is good. Relationships should be based in friendship. Everything else will fade anyway. You cannot just go after the most attractive person, they will be old and wrinkly one day too. Yes attraction plays its role but there is so much more to it. As for living if fear of the "what if"... I get it. You just cannot do that though. Yes it is possible you can fall in love and the other person breaks your heart. In fact it is very likely that it will happen to everyone at some point. However, it is also possible that you will find someone who never breaks your heart, that's what most of us really want. The thing is though, if you never risk giving your heart to someone neither will happen. People always want guarantees and "sure things" but that's just not how it works. If you never know pain, how can you know love?

You are absolutely right in this, "being a virgin shouldn't have to define me"... it doesn't define you. You are much more than a virgin. You are a woman, a daughter, a friend, an employee, a brunette (or whatever), tall/short, skinny/fat, big feet/little feet, etc, etc, etc... You are hundreds of things, don't let any one of them define you. The whole is greater than the sum of its parts. If you don't want to be chained to the "virgin title" then stop giving yourself that title. That doesn't mean give away your virginity it just means don't identify yourself by that. I don't introduce myself as an accountant even though I am one, know what I mean?

Also, don't look at any of your interactions with him as mistakes. They were actions or responses based on what you know and what you were comfortable with, not mistakes. Stay true to yourself.