Right and Wrong

hat is the difference between right and wrong? where does it start, where does it end. How do you know if you're right... are you just talking educated guesses?

Oh and just to start this off on good feeling...

I'm right and you are all wrong!

lol ok. I think there really is no difference, because the definition to what is "right" and what is "wrong" just depends on the person. What may be right to you may not be right to another so basically it just all comes down to the persons perception of what those two are. I think you should just go by what your own morality tells you, but thats just me.

I think there is a basic ingrained morality within each person. For example, most of us don't feed on other humans' flesh (unless in desperate situations, and some tribes I think do, but most of us generally are put off by that), most of us know that your purpose here on earth is not to kill other people, most of us don't torture animals...I think that on the major issues, we have a deep ingrained sense of right vs. wrong. If not, then we would have never thought to make laws and regulations governing society. I do think there are some people who are the exception, some people with chemical imbalances in the brain, emotionally tormented people, etc. And then I think there are some people who get a sick enjoyment out of murdering, torturing, etc. Luckily, the last two groups I mentioned are the minority.

well i dont know, sometimes people get brought up and they think thats the right way but their decisions can always change.. like for instance, when hitler was alive, he had that youth group thing he made and those lil childrens were basically brain washed, until they realized who they were dealing with.

Yes, I agree that little children are like sponges and can be totally corrupted by scumbags who want to brainwash them, children are defenseless and so even if it went against their ingrained sense of morality, they can't really fight back against that because they are smaller, weaker, less powerful.

Good point Luz

Pheonix...How do you know that those are instinctual morals?

We are all fueled by self-interest. Laws were created for our self-interest, I don't want to die so I don't want anyone to kill me therefore lets make a law that prevents people from killing. I think it is the law and social pressure that tells us what's right and what's wrong. Back when we were just savages without any type of government or social structure, we did things for our own good. Even mutual cooperation is for our own good - if we all work together we can hunt the deer successfully and each get a share sort of cooperation. It's also that golden rule "do unto others as you would have them do unto you"... but only in the view of self-interest. Those people who do wrong (excluding the mentally/emotionally unstable) do it because they are fueled by self-interest and do not think they can get caught. An executive accountant knows what's right and wrong, believes in it, but can get away with some embezzlment and will if he/she doesn't think he/she'll get caught.

But as for torturing animals... the basic social pressure against it is there and I can't explain that but what about veal? Baby cows kept tied to a chain unable to walk only fed milk to have tender meat- is that not torture? Or any kind of slaughtering of animals? Of course, that is for survival reasons and our savage ancestors would have done that too. The killing/mutilation of flies and wasps and the famous magnifying glass-with-ants trick is still common. Many people still hunt for sport. It's not as ingrained as you would think.

OK... Right and wrong. I think there are two types of right and wrong: the universal kind, and the kind dictated by society. The universal kind is instinctual, we all know it. The society kind is the hunting for sport, those parties are for it or against depending on what society has taught them. The easiest way, in my opinion, to tell the difference between the universal and society based good and wrong is to put yourself on a desert island with no society and say, if this was all I ever knew, would I have the same morals and values as I do now? (And weirdos like me do this all the time, it's a great basis for fixing writers block.)

Another good way to fix writers block is to put yourself in a post armagaddon world. (The disestablishment of society is so much fun!)

Just one more thought:
Did you ever feel that society can haze a person's view of right and wrong? As a very quick not very thought out example I pose this case:
A person groes up in a cannibal society doesn't see anything wrong with killing a person to eat them. We go there and are horrified. Societies fault?

Well, not to sound oversimplified, but if you think about it, "society" is made up of just a bunch of individuals, so can anything be blamed on society? We each have our own brain, even though a lot of people don't really act like they have their own brain..."ba-a-a-a". lol.

hahaha pheonix, good point ^^

hahaha pheonix, good point ^^

frock...

lol, thank you my sweet one 🙂

Yeah, I never said that society was completely at fault, after all, individuals did set up society. All I'm saying is that it blurs peoples perceptions.

but sometimes i think that even do we are individuals, we do still go by what society wants... and not by what our own morality tells us, but if we did go by our own morality all the time, would this world be in even more chaos than it already is. What if we had no rules, no restrictions. Does this mean that society has some importance or not. Why do we all have to be categorized into different sections, at school, there are the skateres, the breakers, what if the breakers skate also, what category would they fall into this time. So why is that everyone looks down on the ones who seem the "Same". If people are trying to be the same doesnt that mean that they're different either way on the inside when it comes down to it. Isnt everyone just basically unique and different and yet all the same. If i was to go for my dream right now..actually what is my dream? Seems like i have so many and yet none. No support from my parents, no support from my siblings, only a few from friends. Is this what life is all about, striving on your own, or is it what you make of it. If its truly fate then who's going to shake up the system. Why does my mind always wander off, never stays in one place. Everyone just keeps on talking, just keeps on talking. Without knowing what the hell they're talking about. When it comes down to it, everyones the same and yet somehow different. More like we have the same instincts of man and the qualities. But our personalities, talents, thoughts are different. People say they're thinking out of the "box", but what if the people who say that are still thinking in and not out. Maybe we're not really thinking outside of it much, who knows..and wow i got off topic, always happens. Dont mind me, i wasnt even talking to anyone, just thinking to myself but writing it down helps more to sort things out. Anyway, going to bed, night.

even though* >_> see i told you my mind wanders off

Hmmm... It's got to be a very large box... But maybe it's not a box at all... Maybe it's a sphere... But I tend to think that there's no real box... It's all in our minds... Hmmm... honestly, if society was a bad thing, why is it still here? Anyway, some people like the box and the "baaaa", it makes life easier to think about. Gives them security.

You also have to ask yourself.... why have morals changed throughout time? If things were either good or bad, right or wrong, then why do they change throuhgou the course of history.

One example: Homosexuality was fine (i'm talking about Western civilization) in ancient Sparta and Athens and at times encouraged. Time goes on and they are mistreated, it is considered bad or evil, unnatural. Recently we have been ging back towards treating them better... why the change in morals? It was society- the Christian church denounced it, declared it was evil. Now people are divided- is it right or wrong? they ask. The "box" is society's presure on what is right or wrong, as society changes the box changes. Other examles are abortion, child abuse (remember they used to leave them to die if they were deformed), women's rights, and slavery. I'm sure we all agree that slavery and child abuse are wrong and that women deserve rights... but think about the change in right and wrong over time. It never seems to make any sense.

Also ask why the literacy rate has gone up, why information is more readily available, and why democracy has spread.

do you say that as a joke, morgan? Because I'm going to answer it. The first two parts I explain in an essay- the invention of the printing press brought the availability of knowledge and words throughout europe and eventually the world in the mid 1500s. That's why literacy rate has gone up and is still going up...it's the increase availability and emphasis on information.

Democracy has spread because (basically all I've been doing is plagurizing from Rousseau... you really should read him) civilized man of today is constantly reforming society. (you know morgan, I just realized it's easier to argue with you online because you're not always interupting me =). Originally, societies/governments were formed for the benefit of protection- giving in to a strong sort of slavery/loss of rights (dictatorship/warlords/fuedalism etc.). As time goes on, people become more increasingly aware (development of technology, teaching methods, philosophies of politics, etc.) of what liberties are lost. Then eventually a society of the people, by the people, for the people, will arise where everyone is obediant to the laws and the laws obediant to the people.

So there, answered you... or I successfully evaded your question... I don't know which I did.

becusssssssss we want to do anything that we wanttttttttttttttttttttttttttt

becase perception changes

What an interesting topic...one that will stimulate the minds of humans for years to come.

Back in the day....Shakespeare said, "There is nothing good or bad, but THINKING makes it so."

It's ALL in our minds. How we think and this comes from our past experiences but we do have the ablility to change our thoughts. What if....what if we each loved our self just as we are, we then would accept others as they are. If we are filled with that love, all actions and words would come from that place. However, in our society so many people have become, "domesticated" (others beliefs have been imposed on us instead of each one following and trusting our own heart and mind).

Life is definately the "school of life" and what an education we are getting. I have enjoyed reading all of these posts as they are so mentally stimulating.

Got to get the blueberry muffins out of the oven!

"What if....what if we each loved our self just as we are, we then would accept others as they are. If we are filled with that love, all actions and words would come from that place."

This would work if their weren't really messed up people in this world who enjoyed doing really messed up and perverted things. Sometimes there are wrongs that are just inherently WRONG, no matter what education you get. Crimes against nature.

And you are absolutely correct Morganofmind. What you described is the "effect" from not knowing love within oneself. This will always be a concern till we each learn why we are here.

We gotta start somewhere! 🙂

Well, parallex, thank you for the compliment. By the way, did I tell you I was perfect? 😉

right or wrong answer is very funny. In reality there's no right and wrong but only perceptions created by human being earlier and follow on.....
If smart enough, people can turn the right into wrong and the wrong into right or both sides. Just like playing by laws, follow with facts. Sound cruel sometimes and sound good sometimes.
This is what i use to think. We need to have own perception of seeing thing ourselves.Do not always follow by others' thinking of right and wrong.Regret is yours!

I like to follow something close to the ten commandments.

alfie:
Is a person going to hell for stealing a loaf of bread to feed his starving family? If you were that person, would you let your family and yourself starve?

lol!i like that idea, Morgan...

I have the right to be wrong.

ditto morga, and alfie the only real problem I have with the ten commandments is that everyone talks of the "ten" not the "one" or "two" that are really only enforced and followed strictly...if they are all so important, then wouldn't adultery be as strictly punished (in christian and judaic society) as murder?

You know, I bet if they did enforce it, in most societies it would be all the woman's fault... And the man would get off scott free.

DAAAAAAAAAAA this is why shaboom took adultery out. He told me what is the use of being a deity if you can't get laid.

lol... sounds like sound logic to me...

alfie:
"Is a person going to hell for stealing a loaf of bread to feed his starving family? If you were that person, would you let your family and yourself starve?"

How is a family fed on a loaf of bread? Better question.

If he was smart, he would go to local Christian food band and get a few week worth. They could also walk into any local church and they would help him. I challenge anyone.

And if you want to know about going to hell for stealing. Ask John Gotti he made a habit out of stealing and ended up in Marion Prison and thats about as close to hell as you can get!

Difference between mans laws and God's is: You only get so many chances with man's laws, and then they give up and throw the key away.

God never gives up on us.

"if they are all so important, then wouldn't adultery be as strictly punished (in christian and judaic society) as murder?"

They are VERY important. We just donot have the resources to lock up all the adulterers. We could not build prisons fast enough. But because of it, we punish ourselves. What crime is it? The breakup of the family is. Most of crime stems from this and one parent household. Not enough guidance for children. Many studies have shown that children in the prison population and adults came for broken families. You want a better society, April Baby, start there.

okay wehre to begain. this is my play ground. this is my dance floor. ah its been a while but i'm ready. u've brought it on. now i will retort, finnlly.
okay. simple kids are powerful people overesmate such of the human heart. they are more intouch with themselves they and belvie in nearly anything. they can do much. but yes if taught thet this is right when not being taught to have a free mind. u see i was taught to not have one but my mind has always this is apperent by my actions as a child.
Box. hardly that's just a socitey major. it to more or less reprsent one's common thinkning of how one's mind normal runs on a average yr. but i say there is no box. but is of the mind.
yes socitey is good. but u can't blame an entire socitey unless they kill of something. ur prombles are ur own u know there bad and ur cookiemonstering so fix them. Oh duh. it was socitey.
now the repubic the greast form of gov. with the mix of deomocary creating America. which is by defination a repubic for it reprsensts. and another thing Benjamin asked by a lady after finshing the Contsionton parise such the words of it, was asked what have u given us. Why a republlic, madame.
Another thing the Army is irresonsible it does not follow its own rules. for the fact ther 5 star gen. adives the pres. how to act in any mil. action. so if something eriases they can get away with for the man who runs the gov. and enforces law overlooks it thanks for the gen. i hate such rude actions. many people from the army now how to screw and they suck.

thank u jk. for giving us back to litarture. i'm so glad. so we may people who care.

i missed that hom. thing. okay simple due to basic morals of that day it was alowed in grecces but the christians hated now with the embimation of the slaves, much hate of race and creed due to many of the churches respect for eacother becoming intwinede with the rev. of sexualitly. this has come about due to all of it. this was never going away to begin with. socitey tried to forget but they couldn't. and now poeple see that denying there right for sex is wried becase u know poepl looked down of black and white sex was preed down on but it was fine why can't this be. we give equal life and rights to all people that's the root of the promblem. as some scertley wishpher Damn, that phrase. so as i say, give the rights, we already say we give them but we don't hell give them marragie it's not like its goning to devule a hert. marraige or is that the promblem. because we can say hell they slept with eachother beised sodmy thoughts hell they adulterliazed witheachother too. in other words if the bible be true kill damn there souls with many of sins we can define. and get away with.

another not all churches all that kind. another thing is if with no help given i would steal if i had to. i don't give a butter. i saved a life. the greater good. i say in such case. antoher adul. is half bull. my mom is not the same mom my dad married. she would have killed him only faster. adn me with him. live or die. then later married someone else who he truly can love and can be loved back. and even though he is sick with the promblem of wieght. he would have gotten to this point sometime. This way it is at a later time but better placed i say. it really depends upon the pople and one's own beliefs.

the ten comdmants we now today are something differnet then i belvie were attened to be. for instance the one of killing i bilvie meant not when u kill to save urself or family. that sense. another thing. i feel christain has falws just in the sense of many things.

read the gloden charroits and another book. uh it's german its about man and how aliens and stuff fit in i bielve that has much accery go to a good bookstore and they could help u there to find it.

u have to start from family true. but ever since ww2 kids can complain that they have promblems or are abused and ther parents ar

okay it fiqured u read Crime and Pushiment. First educate us about sex all of it. Tell us what's so bad. Canda's doing it and it's running down the brith of pregency. Show us the drugy's who have no life as a kid. Give us a teacher who loves to teach without prejudice and care for the tests that give money or any other odd prombelms to decrationt the teacher and student from their realtionsip from learingnig. Free family nights' where no work familes have to be at home toghter 2 a month including during summer. NO, year around school kid's forget what was taught. Better road's and road clearings an extra 30 mins. a day won't make up for a day lost of class. Put up the kid's rights all of them legal everywehre in the schools where kid's can't miss them and in terms they can read pictures included. Reduce the welfare system. Build up speakeres who can show kids to be open minded. Speakers who can show how dumb drugs are. Legilators not beating on the French or cigrates and using real time for real prombelms. Less of money and maybe they need to have another real job then "politicion". More investment into things built here reduce some tax produce some law to make america the place to work. We nee that. Let peopple out of jail who are going to die becaouse of a termianal illness and some of the old. But with some servaillence. Let their be more parks and more farms. Don't reduce the foundation of the relvtionu of the entire human race after seeds plant seeds grow seeds good to eat. huh huh huh. lOL Build better and more equipet prizions have prisoirns do more give them stuff to do. Don't let them ejnoy their lives in "luxary" without work. Not tourtue but work. So they won't want to go back. This would help society. This doesn't talk about the addition of how to help American' that are over weight cept maybe a walk each day by the students and teachers required. And add to the thing that show's what's in a product use actullay unscientific terms for noraml people to know what their saying. I hope this would help this could work. Who can say?
antoher thing mom just callled and watnts to changet the time on me that cookiemonster anway she says said this all along i eamiled 840 she said okay. God.

well must run
u all have fun
be careful
take care
ttul
until then

James the13th

Well I guess that tells you something.

James Tate can you pls clarify it?

🙂 james13th, a good starting point for your age........
Things not always turn up perfect but keep up ur good value...

thanks i try too.

You can feel if you are right.

"hat is the difference between right and wrong? where does it start, where does it end. How do you know if you're right... are you just talking educated guesses?"

In reality, right and wrong can only be determined by the individual. What may be right to one peron may wrong to another. The only time 'right and wrong' are clearing identified is when the right of others are violated.

It is all a matter of what feild or position on which you stand in/or on. Wrong, or Right blur repeatedly, and sometimes become one resulting in a stalemate of wishes; becuase that is all right, or wrong is, wishes that are in opposing view, that are forcibly strung together for a purpose unknown to us...to me...wrong, right, how far is far enough, I don't know, but this is something to really REAALLLLLLY think about!! I enjoy this, so many ways to act, to respond, to behave, no RIGHT or WRONG... IT BLURS SEE WHAT I MEAN!?!?!. All happiness for example will, or most certainly comes at the unhappiness of others; so does this make happiness wrong to strive, and work for—? once again, WONG, AND RIGHT BLUR. If you getting your way makes someone unhappy, or if your not getting your way makes someone happy, then what is wrong or right? It all comes at someones dismay; if it is wrong to be happy, then basically we should stop this very moment, and stop living; just fall dead in a state of oblivion; becuase we are making people unhappy, and that is wrong; we're taking from someone else's mouth, hurting someone elses chances to rise in the world; becuase our needs are in the way, so I think after all of this,I feel I have found WHERE they start, and possibly when they both end; in us; our wants, our wills, our desires, and considering those of others, when they colide, well wrong or right ensues; it's all a matter of what position you take; are you the benifecit, or the maleficent? the benefactor, or the sufferer?....