Respect - given or earned?

Which one do you think is more true?

RESPECT;

Is it just given?

OR

It's earned?

What came first...the chicken or the egg...

M,

I don't see the connection between what I say and what you say.

One must give in order to receive...yet how can you give when you've yet to receive at first meeting.

Oh now I see. So you are basically saying "respect is in the eye of beholder"?

Not necessarily...although there is a gray area, generally certain actions are global.

Its about having common courtesy initially...common courtesy extended...is respect.

Okay,

Let's change this way;

If you see someone who acts against you in the way you disagree, should you still respect them?

They usually lose mine. I extend civil rights if we MUST interact, but thats all.
With time, apology, and extended gestures of remorse...its possible to be earned back.

Leader: Make the beginning .. show the way.

Follower: Rather than waiting to respond off of another.

vicious...no.

cycle...it should be.

Thanks M.

P-Angel,

I dont get it. How does this relate to our topic?

"vicious...no.

cycle...it should be."

Cycle?

So, from what I can see, you prefer to be secretive rather than direct. Do you think this is leader quality?

If a person only shows respect when it has been earned according to their own personal standards .. then they aren't showing respect at all, rather, rewarding them for adhering to their standards.

Isn't respect is what it is? A reward?

RESPECT;

Haffo: "Is it just given?
Angel: "Leader: Make the beginning .. show the way."

Haffo: "OR, It's earned?"
Angel: "Follower: Rather than waiting to respond off of another."

It should not be a reward. Its should be exactly what it is...respect.

P-Angel, so should you give someone respect who clearly not earn it...in terms of giving it themselves.

Sorry Haffo, I will be less "secretive"...?... for your sake.

Maybe you don't have to lead everyone?

"It should not be a reward."

Why it should not? Give me one reason.

"Sorry Haffo, I will be less "secretive"...?... for your sake."

I was speaking in general meaning.

It's subjective .. everybody's prinipals are different.

Person A makes the determination that respect isn't warranted because Person B isn't adhereing to Person A's own personal standards .. in reality, Person A is the one who's being disrespectful for making the expectation in which Person B has to live up to Person A's standards instead of their own.

Its not about standards for the most part.

Being treated like a human being is all it is.

"Being treated like a human being is all it is."

Then act like one (generally speaking). If you do something bad that is not something for human being to do, then you will not respect??

If you do something that I do not agree with, then you do not respect the amount of respect that I normally would show to someone with whom I agree?


There is such a thing with police here. They treat criminals in the amount of threat they represent.

For example, if you are about to blow up yourself with a bomb in your belt, then you very probably will be shot in your head before you could do it. And if you just hijack a car, police won't shoot you in your head. I think you got the general idea?

It's all about personal standards and nothing about being treated like a human if it's based off of following and not leading, Lady.

If a person standards are different, then how is one to know what kind of treatment seems human, or inhumane to you? Some people actually like to be in voilent stormy relationships, right?

So, my point is .. if the only respect for yourself is only measured by waiting to see how someone is going to treat you and then responding off of it with either a reward or punishment .. then no respect is even given by you, for them to respond off of .. just an unspoken expectation in which they aren't privy .. that makes you the disrespectful one, in this scenerio.

Respect is apart of "Terms of Relating".

Terms of relating have to be made known .. one can't just expect the other to obey. And one person expects the other to obey, then they are the disprectful one.

"So, my point is .. if the only respect for yourself is only measured by waiting to see how someone is going to treat you and then responding off of it with either a reward or punishment ..then no respect is even given by you, for them to respond off of .. just an unspoken expectation in which they aren't privy .. that makes you the disrespectful one, in this scenerio."

Why do you think this way? There could be situations that arouse respect in people? And they will reward others with respect? And thus, things could start and reciprocate as you said give and take?

What I'm trying to say, it should be given for "something" not just empty words you know...

No respect for yourself is not one in the same.
How people treat you can be a bi-product of how you treat yourself though.

"Respect is apart of "Terms of Relating".

Terms of relating have to be made known .. one can't just expect the other to obey. And one person expects the other to obey, then they are the disprectful one."

If I find them stupid, I just don't relate to them and thus, no terms will present??

"Why do you think this way?"


Because my standards & views are different .. the very point I make.

"What I'm trying to say, it should be given for "something" not just empty words you know..."

I agree, but goes back to my theory of the extension of common courtesy being respect.

""Why do you think this way?""

LOL

Terms of relating are ironed out after the initial relations.

"Because my standards & views are different .. the very point I make."

LOL! I didn't said anything relating to that. What I was saying is kinda this "There are examples where people start to feel respect to each other, therefore there is no reason to think that way as you think. So why think then?" kida way..

"I agree, but goes back to my theory of the extension of common courtesy being respect."

Your common courtesy is exactly where respect is given to empty things. Why? Because we all know that not every human being is humane. So generalisation is foolish and anything that requires this generalisation is empty.

How can you judge initially when you dont 'know' the person.


Please leave your serial killer comments at the door. Many of us rarely meet them.

What you are doing is basing the meaning of respect off of how you percieve others should adhere to your definition of the word.

What I'm saying is respect starts with the self, the measurment of this can only be with yourself and not on someone else because they can only be respectful according to their own terms and not yours.

It's not up to others to respect you or disrepectful you and that's what you're saying. It is up to you, as a person, to respect or disrepect others according to your own standards.

You chose to see this as though you are above others .. I choose to see it as though everyone is equal .. I have my standards and they have theirs ..

"How can you judge initially when you dont 'know' the person."

You can't. And I never said I judge them with my first impression. Show me where I said that "I judge according to my first impression".

What I actually do with people is "indifference" rather than shooting salvos of empty words. If I find them to be worthy of my respect, then I give it to them.

"Please leave your serial killer comments at the door. Many of us rarely meet them."

Yes we do not meet serial killers on daily basis, but serial killers is just one of examples. Surely the amount of respect is variable, it's not a unit as a whole. I may respect someone because he's a human, but I won't respect them in business area or political area because I think he's a stupid. Therefore different amounts of respect is given to people. The point is, are we giving respect to people who worth it, or just use it as a means of ass licking and simply without meaning it, thus empty.

Haffo, when you learn self-respect .. the answer to this will become clear. You'll see then that it's not up to another to respect you .. it's up to you.

Well initial meeting has been my point all along.

Common courtesy is a form of indifference. When you hold the door open for a stranger woman/man when walking into a building do you truly care about them... no. Its just a thing you do...common courtesy, manners, civility...expressed between people.

"What you are doing is basing the meaning of respect off of how you percieve others should adhere to your definition of the word."

Exactly! And I don't think there is another way of weighing people. After all, respect is about weighing people.

"The point is, are we giving respect to people who worth it, or just use it as a means of ass licking and simply without meaning it, thus empty."


To you, the respect you have to give is empty, without meaning .. a tool to use for ass licking ..

.. to me it's full and has meaning, a tool to use as an example of how I respect myself.

"Haffo, when you learn self-respect .. the answer to this will become clear. You'll see then that it's not up to another to respect you .. it's up to you."

How can self respect be related to how others respect you? And what is this "self respect" thing is?

"To you, the respect you have to give is empty, without meaning .. a tool to use for ass licking .. "

No, it's not. I don't throw empty respect words if I don't mean it. My sentence was "are giving this way or the other way" style . There are two meanings in one sentence P, you missed it.

"Well initial meeting has been my point all along.

Common courtesy is a form of indifference. When you hold the door open for a stranger woman/man when walking into a building do you truly care about them... no. Its just a thing you do...common courtesy, manners, civility...expressed between people."

Ok. I see.

But I wasn't talking about initial meeting courtesy, I was talking about laters. Because some people think respect should be maintained at all costs. WTF?

I see....when at that point.

If there comes a time when it shouldnt be maintained then ...no.

Haffo, I didn't miss your meaning .. what you meant was, from your perspective, is that people give respect out to people they believe aren't worth it, it therefore becomes meaningless and empty .. I get what you're saying, Haffo .. but, you are missing my point.

"respect out to people they believe aren't worth it". What you believe is worth it, may not be what antoher believes .. so, a person therefore can't be liable to live up to what you believe is worth it, they can only live up to what they themselves believe is worthy.

Still, you base this off of what you believe and think other's have a responsibility to obide by it, and they don't. They only have to live up to their own standards .. nobody owes you anything. The only thing that's owed to you, is what you can give yourself.

"some people think respect should be maintained at all costs."

And I believe this whole-heartedly .. the respect I have for myself should be maintained at all costs.

P-Angel,

What is the point of interacting with people who do not share the same values with you?

In other words, you wouldn't bend your view to be compatible with someone, for the sake of growth .. that person must have your values, or they aren't worthy of you.

Otherwise, what's the point, right?

Hypothetical Situation:

You have a job, and you are in the middle of a very important project. You get along with your boss and both you and him have great respect for each other. You are working diligently and giving 100% .

Half-way through the project, your boss changes to another person to whom you don't like and can't get along with. He doesn't have the same values as you do in life, nor in the work place, so you therefore have no respect for him.

Now, do you quit your job, because what's the point in sharing anything with someone to whom has different values and certainly, if you don't respect him then how can he possibly be worthy of your time and effort?

What about your self-respect? Does that not matter? The only thing that matters in which directs your outcomes is whether another person is worthy of you? Are you not worthy of yourself?

"In other words, you wouldn't bend your view to be compatible with someone, for the sake of growth .. that person must have your values, or they aren't worthy of you.

Otherwise, what's the point, right?"

Growth is different. I can expand the coverage area of my values, but I won't change them. Not at least I'm convinced the otherwise. But at the core values, hell yeah, I won't stay with a person who do not share them.

And if I don't get along, and don't respect, then I waste my time with that person or people.


"Now, do you quit your job, because what's the point in sharing anything with someone to whom has different values and certainly, if you don't respect him then how can he possibly be worthy of your time and effort?"

Of course. If someone deals with someone else who has contrary values than I have, then this boss also has these contrary values that I don't accept. I won't stay with that boss any more second.

But different values should be defined first. Not all different values are hostile for me. I'm just neutral to them. But some qualities are hostile for me, and at this point, I won't tolerate nor that worker, nor that boss.

"What about your self-respect? Does that not matter? The only thing that matters in which directs your outcomes is whether another person is worthy of you? Are you not worthy of yourself?"

I don't know what you mean by self respect, but I definetly not feel myself "deserved" to be staying near such people and thus I'm preserving my own value.

I too believe it is about common courtesy initially; giving people the benefit of the doubt, unless proven otherwise. And even then, with sound reason. So generally speaking; taking others feelings into consideration, keeping an open mind, agreeing to disagree, loving yourself, building someone up instead of tearing them down..

We may learn that our lives go better when we respect the things that deserve to be respected from the deeper aspects of our hearts, and that we should respect some things 'independently' of considerations of how our own lives would go.

Of course respect, ought to be extended, as well to things other than humans alone; such as nonhuman living things and the natural environment.

"thus I'm preserving my own value."

By quitting your job because you can find no tolerance?

That is what I mean by self-respect, Haffo. In that scenerio .. that was YOUR job. You made a committment to your employer, irrespective of who was the supervisor and to show a lack of integrity by quitting the post due to a difference in values shows a lack of respect to yourself and your reliability to complete your task.

See .. respect of self comes first. Once you have that, then the rest becomes clearer.


I can relate to exactly what you're saying, DK .. and as this relates to what I was saying .. this rookie didn't give up, simply because he wasn't getting the respect he thought he deserved. Why? Because he respected his own ability to prove his worth to himself and because of this integrity of his own self-worth, through self-respect .. he was able to earn this of others. Had he just quit, and had a bad attitude, then 2 years later tried to make a team .. he would be turned away no matter how good he was at the sport because the auditioning coach would see him as a quitter .. Hence: no self-respect for his abilities to trust himself .. therefore, no trust that he would have respect for his team.

It starts with the self, Haffo .. no matter which way you slice it. It's not up to another to show you anything that you can't show yourself, to yourself and to others.