Is power the ability to persuade multitudes of people?

Warren Jeffs 12/3/1955 is the owner and runs the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. And even though he is in prison for the rest of his life .... he still runs the entire church, some 10,000 members +

Surely, people can be brainwashed. We have seen this time and again with religious cults, but, this one is different. With Jim Jones, David Koresh, Applegate, etc ... all of those cult leaders believed themselves to be god, and convinced their people that they were god. But, they were few in comparison to 10,000. for example, at Heaven's Gate, only 39 people died following him. Jim Jones had a bigger following .. but, nothing holds a candle to 10,000+

And he's in prison, still running the show. Now that's remarkable.



Pablo Escobar 12/1/1949 was the most powerful man in Columbia, maybe he would have been the world if he didn't die. Anyway, he was considered extremely dangerous and without a conscious .... yet, he was loved by all the people of Columbia and nearby countries.

When he died, there were over 25,000 people who came to mourn his death ... like wow, so though he may have been very dangerous and he was dangerous .... at the same time, he was so convincing, so charming - that he could lead a person into believing they should die for his cause.


I mean, there's other mentioned above, as well as Manson, Moon and countless others .... but, it seems like only these two Sags had/have the ability to really finesse the people. So, I guess my ponderings here are: are Sags the ultimate criminal?

Furthermore .... is there a such thing as a criminal being good for what they do?

Warren Jeffs has brought such meaning to people lives, that they are happily dedicated to this cause, regardless of the crimes being committed, according to society's standards. Look at the people living within these standards, unhappy and miserable as fuck. So, living within the expected standards of society doesn't mean you will be handed a satisfying life where you feel important, trusted and wanted.

And here is this group of religious zealots who would defy this standard and live "by choice" in such a community as the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints ..... an organization where girls are married very young to older men. Keeping in mind that when I say by choice, I mean the adults.

Warren Jeffs has been in prison since 2011 and his church grows in numbers by leaps and bounds.

So, is he really a good energy to be linked to? If people feel this amazing in their lives and this connected to their people .... then how is that bad? ... just because the part of society who views themselves as normal doesn't agree, does that make what he's doing wrong?

how is it wrong, if the people want to be a part of it.



Just more pondering here ...... is he a good person or bad person?

I think Sags do have a very dark side of them that is rarely touched on. They're naturally philosophical and self-righteous, live by their own rules, are complete loners but incredibly chameleonic, and are constantly fighting for they perceive as correct. I think the risk here is becoming so emotionally cloistered inside their own perception of what is good that they lose a sense of empathy. They're also extremely persuasive and have that sort of tone that can woo you into jumping into a ravine for them. Ted Bundy, prolific serial killer, was a Sag if I remember correctly.

To your second question, well... In my opinion, if a group of people are energized and loved by one another without any ingrained bigotry, hatred, self harm or harm of nonbelievers, than they should be allowed to practice what they want. There are definitely emotional benefits to being closed off from the world, in living truly for your 'cause' whatever that may be. At the same time, it's rare that a largely practiced religious cult or cult-like entity *doesn't* spread bigotry, fear, or enforce a medieval caste system in the modern day. So, what is right? Who knows! It's a very roundabout conundrum.

Posted by scorpionmoon
I think Sags do have a very dark side of them that is rarely touched on. They're naturally philosophical and self-righteous, live by their own rules, are complete loners but incredibly chameleonic, and are constantly fighting for they perceive as correct. I think the risk here is becoming so emotionally cloistered inside their own perception of what is good that they lose a sense of empathy. They're also extremely persuasive and have that sort of tone that can woo you into jumping into a ravine for them. Ted Bundy, prolific serial killer, was a Sag if I remember correctly.

To your second question, well... In my opinion, if a group of people are energized and loved by one another without any ingrained bigotry, hatred, self harm or harm of nonbelievers, than they should be allowed to practice what they want. There are definitely emotional benefits to being closed off from the world, in living truly for your 'cause' whatever that may be. At the same time, it's rare that a largely practiced religious cult or cult-like entity *doesn't* spread bigotry, fear, or enforce a medieval caste system in the modern day. So, what is right? Who knows! It's a very roundabout conundrum.

this is an interesting subject, whereas i was mentioning about the gem/sag axis, and the gemini dark side is easily seen (doing multiple bad things, however they go about it)

and here, we have Ted Bundy, a great case of Triple Sag, Sun/Moon/Mars with lilith in sag too.

what are the dark sides that is seen in the sag dominant? Since ruled by Jupiter, (Ted Bundy's case is super dark side though, it's not like he was just cheating or armed robbery, he was a devioius, horrific serial killer)
http://www.astrotheme.com/astrology/Ted_Bundy

he was also Pluto dominant so he used his Plutonic energies (he has a Scorpio stellium) for really exteme darkness, mental insanity.

so he seemed to have expressed that by manipulating his victims, using that magnetic powerful energy.

i guess with Jupiter dominant/ruled they think they are so grand and great? and if coupled with all that plutonic energy and even he has that leo rising, he will believe he is a kind of god? It's really hard to understand the mind of a serial killer, and i know lots of astrologers try to understand and make /create articles on it.

jim jones has NO Sagittarius, and NO scorpio, (I didnt even see 8th or 9th house there) but he too had the ability to persuade people, so i dont know.... he was a taurus sun/aries moon/leo mars/aries venus.

http://www.astrotheme.com/astrology/Jim_Jones_(cult)

It's a very different situation with Warren Jeffs, though ...... he is able to keep his people of 10,000 together strong and faithful, even while in prison.

If people are outcasted in society, if they feel lost, or unloved, feel trivial and of no importance .... if a cult makes them (((((( feel )))))) worthy of themselves, and they have a valuable place in life in where they are respected, loved and trusted ......


.... how could that possibly be wrong, just because other people in society don't understand them.


think about that.

Posted by P-Angel

It's a very different situation with Warren Jeffs, though ...... he is able to keep his people of 10,000 together strong and faithful, even while in prison.

If people are outcasted in society, if they feel lost, or unloved, feel trivial and of no importance .... if a cult makes them (((((( feel )))))) worthy of themselves, and they have a valuable place in life in where they are respected, loved and trusted ......


.... how could that possibly be wrong, just because other people in society don't understand them.


think about that.

i need to read up on Warren Jeffs. that IS impressive to keep thousands faithful and strong.

it's very true if you're an outcast in society, you want (you= general) want to belong to a family.

family really is very important, the more a person understands this deeply.

the problem with these folks, is that they have a huge misuse of power.

ok i found some astrology sites posting about him too.

http://www.astroknowlogy.com/questions/monogamy-or-polygamy-is-there-a-clue-in-the-natal-chart-of-an-individual

1.Warren Steed Jeffs (wikepedia): is the president of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (FLDS Church). In 2011, Jeff’s was convicted of two felony counts of child sexual assault. Jeffs gained international notoriety in May 2006 when he was placed on the FBI’s Ten Most Wanted List for unlawful flight to avoid prosecution on Utah state charges related to his alleged arrangement of illegal marriages between his adult male followers and underage girls. He was arrested in August 2006 in Nevada, and agreed to be taken to Utah for trial. In May and July 2007 the State of Arizona charged him with eight additional counts, including sexual conduct with minors and incest, in two separate cases. * “Learned members, W.S. Jeffs is now a fugitive from his place in remote township. He was “Prophet, Mormon, Advocated polygamy, abused young girls, had many wives, owned millions of dollars and unaccountable wealth. Now on run from law.”*

He could have Moon in conjunction Uranus (since we do not have his birth time) in Leo (children). Suggesting a weird (Uranus) approach to children (Leo) and unusual kind of nurturing towards the women (Moon) in his life. He was accused of child sexual assault and having too many wives. He also has Saturn in Scorpio, indicating to be a manipulator of sex.

Jupiter/Pluto conjunction makes an easy aspect to Uranus/Moon a semisextile, making it simple and easy for him to get excessively (Jupiter) what he wants in the Uranus/Moon themes, in a sexual way (Pluto).

He also have Mars in Scorpio conjunction Neptune in Libra by degrees. Mars symbolizes the sexual energy, he is known also for his ‘prophet’ and had many women following him, his sexual energy could be expressing trough spiritual orientation, I believe that conjunction is at his midheaven. Mars also sextile Venus, where his relationships were supported by his numerous wives.

Google “Yearning for Zion” for more information."

according to the site, he is Sag sun/Leo moon/ Scorpio Mars/Scorpio saturn/ Venus Cap, Jupiter Virgo. 9th house sun and merc.

he has strong scorpionic energy in the 8th house. the plutonic energy went wrong.

and the Jupiter ruled = expansion, with his cult, and family = cap influence, virgo influence too.

he looks very creepy.