A year ago today...

... after 8 years and five months, my Lioness told me "I love you, but I'm no longer in love with you", and there it ended. (Un)happy anniversary sweet lady.

Awwww. 😢

that's sad and all but uhm...

not knowing the situation, i always wondered how *shocked* a man could be when a relationship crumbles after so many years WITHOUT a ring?

i don't care what a woman's stance on marriage is, the ultimate show of "i love you" after you've been dating for years is for a man to get down on one knee. the longer you date, the more i think a woman has to ask herself, "what's wrong with me that he doesn't want to definitively say he will be with me forever?" i mean hell, does the ring change anything? the relationship has already lasted longer than most marriages so what could it hurt? why is he so hell bent on NOT doing it?

i think over time it's a slap in the face and for some (most) women, that can eat away at you. friends are getting married left and right after being with guys for only a few years and there you are, with the same rat bastard for nearly a decade and he doesn't even know what your ring size is.

so for me, is it any wonder that a woman will lose affection for a man she believes will forever keep her at arms length? will she not yearn for a guy who wants to hold her close and never let her go?...literally.

not everyone is like u, tubby, so don't go around shooting urself in the foot there.

i am perfectly happy never getting legally married. marriage starts inside. i feel loved when a man continues to choose me on a daily basis. if he's there for years on end than i take that as a great sign! i don't need a ring, a wedding reception, or an ego boost from an adoring crowd. what i would really like is that he share his life with me. he plans his future with me in it. we buy a house together, fix it up together, grocery shop, and all that other domestic stuff.

if all ur focusing on is how suzy's husband proposed to her after only a year, and how jane got engaged last week, ur missing out on the good u already have. why does not getting married make u feel less of urself? why does it lower ur self worth? why do u make it that way? it seems to me that u try to seek ur worth in others when u should really be getting it from urself first. "what's wrong with me that he doesn't want to definitively say he will be with me forever?"

^^^you can fool yourself but you'll be playing yourself. women's lib my entire ass!

what gave you the impression that a man getting down on one knee requires a wedding or a reception? propose with tin foil, go to the justice of the peace, send out an e-card as an announcement...what the hell does that have to do with anything?

marriage it's a time-honored tradition. it's a rite of passage. it's no different than a christening, baptism, sweet sixteen, a bat mitzvah, birthdays, HS/college graduation.... we do these grand or not so grand gestures throughout life. marriage doesn't get knocked off of that list simply because you're getting old and the pickin's are slim.

i can hold open my own door but i appreciate it when a man does it.

i can take out my own garbage but i appreciate it when a man does it.

i can put on my own coat, fasten my own necklace, massage my own feet, wash my own car...but i appreciate it when a man does it.

contrary to popular belief, liberation does not require the eradication of chivalry. if you want to lower YOURself and YOUR standards in YOUR youth to believe that you'd be thrilled to spend the rest of your life with a man, make babies with him and not have him make the gesture of a proposal as a show to you, those who care about you and your MUTUAL children that you two are one, then you're foolish, you'll recognize soon enough that you're in denial and you deserve the metaphorical slap in the face.

the only reason that a woman in this day and age should be unwilling to get married is if she's sitting on a ton of money and her potential spouse isn't as wealthy...oprah.

any man worth his salt won't give a damn what you CLAIM to want. if he cares for you, if he wants to honor you, he will get down on one knee and pop the question. that's his role as MAN and if you're dating a "man" who's willing to rent for life rather than own, he's a jackass and you and your kids are the losers.

satori, statistically you're better off not marrying and messing it up for your future spouse anyway. especially if he doesn't come from a failed union. you'd just bring the relationship down anyway.

and how pitiful of you to be so close-minded to allow a horrible past to dictate this aspect of your future. if you're worried about finances, there's this thing called a PRE-NUP!

and people who like living by themselves fall but can't get up...sorta like your take on marriage. you fell and don't want to get up. i hope you have stock in life alert.

wow, very foolish. satori said - "a piece of paper means nothing to me."

"As her partner of 17 years slipped into a coma, Janice Langbehn pleaded with doctors and anyone who would listen to let her into the woman's hospital room.

Eight anguishing hours passed before Langbehn would be allowed into Jackson Memorial Hospital's Ryder Trauma Center. By then, she could only say her final farewell as a priest performed the last rites on 39-year-old Lisa Marie Pond.

Jackson staffers advised Langbehn that she could not see Pond earlier because the hospital's visitation policy in cases of emergency was limited to immediate family and spouses -- not partners. In Florida, same-sex marriages or partnerships are not recognized. On Friday, two years after her partner's death, Langbehn and her attorneys were in federal court, claiming emotional distress and negligence in a suit they filed last June."

source: http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/05/12/how-hospitals-treat-same-sex-couples/<BR>
--

you're view of this is just plain foolish. hopefully there will never come a time where you will have to face reality, but IF you do, especially after spending decades with someone you love, when/if his family prohibits you from entering the house to get a photo or momento or the hospital denies you access even though your lover has no close/living relatives for one of many examples, you'll feel like a complete ass for having not signed that piece of paper that you now claim didn't mean a damn thing to you.

why is it that those who are denied rights understand the magnitude of possessing those rights and those who have them, poo upon them?

oh, and oprah gave more than one reason for not getting married just as she gave many for not having children over the years. among those reasons is, she ain't financial stupid but shackin up with absolutely no financial basis is.

or imagine taking a primary role in raising your lover's children. you spend years with these kids and they view you as mother. lover dies. lover's family swoops in and wants custody of the kids. you're not family. you're not a step parent. legally, the court will side with the extended family....in spite of your being the only "real" mother the children know.

but yeah, it's just a piece of paper

oh, i got another one when i was in the shower...

what if you purchase a doggie for your lover that is your bff as well. lover passes away. family takes the dog.

remember terry shivo? what if you and your lover have discussed end of life decisions. you know if he wants to be cremated or buried. you know where he would like to be laid to rest. you know if he wants to donate organs or remain on life support. he knows the same for you. guess how much of that matters without a piece of paper? not a damn thing.

the point is, if you plan on spending your life with someone, there's nothing to fear. in fact, if you two care for one another, you should want to wed.

and as far as handling these things legally before tragedy strikes, the court doesn't have to honor a dead parent's wishes to award the children to a guardian. if bio mom wants them, if bio fam wants them, your rights dramatically diminish. and imagine that they go live with bio fam and you discover years later that the children are living in separate foster homes. that the bio fam has run through their inheritance. but yeah, just a piece of paper.

or better yet, let's say you have power of attorney. the hospital will probably need to see that. but your on vacation in florida. so now you're desperately trying to find a friend/fam to go to your home to find the paperwork and fax to the hospital. in the meantime, lover dies. but gee, it's just a piece of a paper.

i could go on and on but i shall spare you and myself.

lata

Posted by tubbyscubby
^^^you can fool yourself but you'll be playing yourself. women's lib my entire ass!

what gave you the impression that a man getting down on one knee requires a wedding or a reception? propose with tin foil, go to the justice of the peace, send out an e-card as an announcement...what the hell does that have to do with anything?

marriage it's a time-honored tradition. it's a rite of passage. it's no different than a christening, baptism, sweet sixteen, a bat mitzvah, birthdays, HS/college graduation.... we do these grand or not so grand gestures throughout life. marriage doesn't get knocked off of that list simply because you're getting old and the pickin's are slim.

i can hold open my own door but i appreciate it when a man does it.

i can take out my own garbage but i appreciate it when a man does it.

i can put on my own coat, fasten my own necklace, massage my own feet, wash my own car...but i appreciate it when a man does it.

contrary to popular belief, liberation does not require the eradication of chivalry. if you want to lower YOURself and YOUR standards in YOUR youth to believe that you'd be thrilled to spend the rest of your life with a man, make babies with him and not have him make the gesture of a proposal as a show to you, those who care about you and your MUTUAL children that you two are one, then you're foolish, you'll recognize soon enough that you're in denial and you deserve the metaphorical slap in the face.

the only reason that a woman in this day and age should be unwilling to get married is if she's sitting on a ton of money and her potential spouse isn't as wealthy...oprah.

any man worth his salt won't give a damn what you CLAIM to want. if he cares for you, if he wants to honor you, he will get down on one knee and pop the question. that's his role as MAN and if you're dating a "man" who's willing to rent for life rather than own, he's a jackass and you and your kids are the losers.

i can appreciate ur perspective. i think it's great u stand strong on ur convictions. however, i live by my own rules and convictions as well. what is good for u is not always good for everyone. plus not every woman wants to have kids either.

besides, i have a neutral stance on marriage. i do not desire it but i do not oppose it either. if it seemed right, and was important to my partner, then i would probably go fo

meh.

I actually came to similar conclusions awhile ago tubby. I notice around 2 years, women start getting cranky if a guy hasn't proposed something. Just saying.

there was a time when I wasn't sure if love was for me or what I wanted, now I am pretty sure it is. 🙂 And if my partner doesn't propose at some point, I will probably be moving on. Because at this point in my life, love means marriage.

you partake in the system every waking moment of your life but nice for you to take a stand when it comes to this. i mean, out of all the injustices and crappy laws on the books, you choose THIS one to take a stand.

sounds lak ta me, someone is carrying baggage and fear from a broken marriage. someone has decided that if one relationship failed and they participated in that failure, it's not worth risking the hurt and turmoil again. and if so, sounds lak ta me that said person is right, you should NEVER get married as statistically and emotionally you're far too immature to unite with someone...especially someone who doesn't believe in drive-by divorces. and finally, sounds lak ta me, the only fear that you subject yourself to is that which is self-inflicted.

there are some women/men who loved their spouses, gave their all and who in retrospect may have done this/that differently...to SAVE the marriage early on rather than having it head south. but those people can't control a spouse who drinks or one who beats them or the kids or who cheats, etc etc etc... in those instances, i understand why a person would be so wounded as to fear giving their heart again but that's not the same as taking an anti-marriage stance.

but you're not talking about that fear...or at least not acknowledging it. you said you're willing to spend the rest of your life in a committed relationship without a "piece of paper." in a way, that makes you anti-feminist...anti-progressive. it's like a black person or a woman who doesn't exercise her right to vote. you may have a few reason why you shouldn't. there are thousands of graves and battlescars around this country that demo why you should.

On Gloria Steinhem getting married for the first time in her 60's - 'Gloria must have watched over the last several years as all these gays are getting married, lesbians are getting married. Really, there's no political reason not to get married anymore. Is this some sort of renegade position that she's taken? It isnt. She's following a trend in society today, people wanting to declare themselves in a partnership that has legal sanction.

in other words, WHY THE HELL NOT when you have every legal and social protection afforded to you? oh that's right...you're scared you're going to fail. what a crappy way to love.

Aw. Hugs to VM20

Posted by LeoLadyLovesToBeLoved
Aw. Hugs to VM20

Thanks you 🙂

Just for the record, I never had any commitment issues. When we'd been together just a few months she showed me drawings she'd done of her dream engagement ring and wedding dress, and we looked in shops at rings too, and I was all for it as something that we could do when we'd been together a bit longer, which she agreed with - she wasn't wanting commitment there and then because it was too soon. When it was early on and commitment was a future consideration rather than something that was likely to happen imminently she was 100% enthusiastic, possibly because she was "safe" from any risk of it really happening at that point. It was after a couple of years when we reached a point where we'd been together long enough for commitment to be a reality that she started to display trust issues and would never go that last little bit to make it happen. I was 100% for getting engaged, getting married, etc., but she backed off and kept me at arms length for the rest of our days together. I spent the 6.5 years that followed trying to prove my devotion to her, but I never succeeded, and then finally she finished it, so it was nothing to do with me not wanting to put a ring on her finger - I DID WANT TO and I made sure she knew it!

did you get a ring?

did you ever actually propose?

Posted by tubbyscubby
did you get a ring?

did you ever actually propose?

In the first instance she said if we ever got engaged she wanted to design the ring, so when the time came I suggested that we go and give her designs to a jewellers and have the ring made and then I'd propose properly once I had the ring. That's when she backed off. There was certainly no lack of intent on my part. It was as though the reality of it made her take a step back.

what year into the relationship was "the time" to do this? when did you suggest you two go to the jeweler?

ummm dude? she took you ring shopping within months of the relationship? I wish I had half the balls to do that but I think you missed the boat.

(((VM))))