Scorpio Taurus - turning into mud

My scorpio and taurus friends are married to each other for 20 years, we have been friends for nearly 10 years and we are very very close, scorpio is my best male friend and i'd go so far as to say he is my best friend, he says for sure i'm his best friend. My lovely taurus lady is my best female friend for sure, no-one messes with her or they??ll feel my roar. They are having such terrible problems in their marriage for the last few years, but for the last 2 years things have gone to hell. Obviously i'm aware of both sides as they both talk to me about what it is the other does that upsets them. Had a good talk with the scorpio this morning, he is so depressed, but the gist of it was that over the last 2 years when I kindof disappeared inside my shell for a lot of the time (coping with my own marriage breakdown and getting the kids into an ok place with it all — during which both of them were rocks whenever I needed them) and wasn't around for them as much as I'd been over the previous 8 years, that they had no distractions from what their marriage had become and this is why its gone so badly wrong during that 2 years. Now I've come back out and am spending a lot more time with them, but for me this is a difficult one as they are constantly bickering, and as I have had to work on myself a lot, its difficult for me to sit with them and listen to it without my head getting wrecked. Last weekend when we were all together I was determined not to allow them to get into the bickering state and made the evening one of fun and laughter, not very hard for a leo 😉. Scorpy said that after I had left they stayed up chatting and really continued a great conversation together which hadn't happened for a long time, taurus was in a happy state of mind after our evening. He's asked me now to take her out on Sunday night as she always comes back in a great mood after we go out together. Not a problem for me as I would do anything to help them, but my dilemma is: Am I the paper that's now covering the cracks in their marriage. Is this right? They be addressing the problems instead of covering them up — how to make them see this when I have told them it already? And they agree but are both too stubborn to do anything about it.

Scorpy says he just can't when I voiced this to him, he knows he's stubborn and he knows he's holding it all in, except when he gets to let it out with me, he is also aware that he will explode one day and knows this isn't the right way to handle things.?

Taurus is stubborn also, and locks her feelings away, smoldering, then unleashes them. Being a Taurus she is great with words ??_ and can deliver the anger well. Then scorpy goes ice quiet locking even more inside himself. She has a lot of issues from their past, how they got together, what he did in the early days, that she can't let go (is this a Taurus thing?). She just says, well you know what he's like, when I suggest that they need to sit down and talk, go to counselling or whatever. They are so angry with each other — but there is no way in hell either of them is going to end the marriage, so this is them for the rest of their lives? Any thoughts on what these two need to show each other, need from each other?

Posted by TaurusManUk
"She has a lot of issues from their past, how they got together, what he did in the early days, that she can't let go (is this a Taurus thing?)"

How did they get together? Anyhow I think she could be insecure and at a disadvantage. I know when I feel like I am at a disadvantage and measure things materially I become all defensive which forces me into a 'preemptive defensive strike' of various degrees and gradients at the other person. She probably feels like he could leave her or will leave her?

Just a further two cents.

They got together in the normal way, boy meets girl etc. she became pregnant after a year or so and he decided he wasn't ready for parenthood, left her, didn't go to the babies christening as she wouldn't agree to the godparent he wanted, when the baby was a year old he decided he was ready now and they resumed their relationship, he then wanted to get married as he wanted the child to have his name and wouldn't have a child of his whose parents weren't married. He was quite controlling during there first years together (for example completly organised the whole wedding and wouldn't allow her father to buy the flowers which he traditionally did for all of his children), is still like this to an extent, she usually lets him have his way, but is not doing so so much now. She can't forgive the start 20 years on and he admits what he did was horrible. This beginning is frequently brought up.

I'm not entirely sure that she feels he will stay with her so you may be right there.

Posted by robyn808
I totally agree with TaurusManUK. Even if it happened 20 years ago, he probably still believes it could happen again. for give but not forget. And to be honest if he left her in the beginning under those circumstances, she will most likely never allow herself to truly be vulnerable to him, because its the only control she has over the pain she will feel if it happens again. And whatever pain she showed on the outside, multiply that by 100 and that's how she really felt. These two signs are the opposite, similar but different.

I don't think your holding this relationship together. Every person needs some sort of outlet away from their relationship to be a whole person, and she's lucky to have that in her friendship with you. He hasn't done enough to show her that she can put her faith and trust in him again, and it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. She's the one that has set the bar on what it will take to earn that back. And it might be to higher then he can reach. That's why I don't go back, I'm not saying I couldn't trust someone again, but I'm pretty sure they don't want to go through it. I need to see a lot of constancy and one screw up and your back where you started. Sorry! You loose, try again.

But if they get to the point were they break up, seriously stay out of it, you don't want to be around for what could happen.

Hi Robyn, thanks for your insight, I know i'm not holding it together and that I am an outlet as such. I have spoken to him about their past and what he is doing now about it, he maintains she showed forgiveness and acceptance by marrying him but even saying that he knows she still holds ill feeling about it, he says she shouldn't and therefore refuses to address it - he's stubborn as hell, as is she, so that part should be now closed as far as he is concerned. The big problem here is they will not separate - ever. But yet are too stubborn to do anything about it, if it does happen I will be staying far away!

Posted by TaurusManUk
"She can't forgive the start 20 years on and he admits what he did was horrible"

I think you have answered the post there and then.

Thanks for all your insight Taurusman - she can't and won't forgive, he won't address it and neither will she, she says he knows what he did - they will remain married and I know at some point I'm going to have to step back from them. I've received great insight into their personalities from this and the scorpio boards, most of it I already knew, but i think if i refuse to talk to them about it now they will have to combust with each other eventually - at the moment they are getting all of their frustrations out via me - if i no longer allow it maybe they will burst forth with each other, and one way or another make the changes that need to happen.

Posted by IntriguedScorp
Right now, in my real life, I have a good friend who just got divorced and two other couples heading for divorce court because--and I hate to say this--the woman in the relationship cannot let go of something that happened at the beginning of the marriage. It's almost as if they are holding onto the "thing" that caused their delusions of happily ever after to explode. It is very sad.

What is the statute of limitations on being a prick? Then again, if you are married and you can't truly forgive someone--that's not really forever after love, is it?

exactly. bold emphasis. i read this and thought, that's amazing, 20 years! but then the couple is in europe and couples stay married a long time there, and in other countries.

couples will always have problems. if it's always nice and sweet, it's boring.

so sorry to hear about your friend's problems, but 20 years should not be put down the drain over something he did or did not do. so what? get over it. he's been there through thick and thin and all she's doing is sitting back reminiscing the past that's been a sore thumb for her? that's a formula for destruction.

another thing, no offense, but you having confidente between the tau and the scorp man, seems iffy. maybe they have communication problems and they need a mediator, but damn, sorry, some people will say it's none of your business.
this can also be set up later that you and him will get closer and what will people think then?
sorry again, i just see the future, of what can happen. it's a bad train wreck.