@SirHorns
12 Years5,000+ Posts
I don't know how to feel about this view...
well in my experience, caps aren't dictators, they just want to be respected and go by the book. I feel like caps get annoyed with geminis during business dealings, because they hate flip flopping. The dictatorship is more of a scorp thing imo
Posted by biosynthesis
well in my experience, caps aren't dictators, they just want to be respected and go by the book. I feel like caps get annoyed with geminis during business dealings, because they hate flip flopping. The dictatorship is more of a scorp thing imo
Funny thing, it wasn't a Cap running things like that.
Though I can see what you mean there.
Yes to Scorpio dictatorship. Obey or be nuked.
I feel that a good leader needs to be able to listen to and really consider other ideas than their own, but they nessessarily need to also be able to make their own decisions and put their foot down with those.
What they also need to be able to do, imo, is to make it known that there actually is a reason for their decisions and if those reasons are "because I'm right and awsome and stfu," then noone will listen or care about the task. I feel the best way to get people to do a great job is to make them want to do it. If they know why they are doing something and feel that they are actually contributing and that they are valued, then they are prepared to really move heaven and earth for the company.
Hence, the attitude that you mention is imo not only rude, but also stupid.
Depends on the relationships.
If it's parents saying that to a 19 yo kid, then yes. My house, I'm paying the mortgage, the bills, buying the groceries, so my rules, if you don't like it then there's the door.
If it's a business, I'm responsible financially, my name is on the door, I've got the responsibility of making sure regulations are followed correctly, (OSHA, IRS, etc), then yes, if you don't like it you can leave.
If I'm a manager and my job is on the line, I won't allow your noncompliance to cost me my job, so you can transfer to another department or leave.
If it's friends, then no, it's not appropriate.
Some work situations, not appropriate.
Really, though, having that attitude at work doesn't gain cooperation and respect, so I probably wouldn't use that tactic. With my young adult children - yes, it's appropriate in all cases.
Posted by truecap
Depends on the relationships.If it's parents saying that to a 19 yo kid, then yes. My house, I'm paying the mortgage, the bills, buying the groceries, so my rules, if you don't like it then there's the door.
If it's a business, I'm responsible financially, my name is on the door, I've got the responsibility of making sure regulations are followed correctly, (OSHA, IRS, etc), then yes, if you don't like it you can leave.
If I'm a manager and my job is on the line, I won't allow your noncompliance to cost me my job, so you can transfer to another department or leave.
If it's friends, then no, it's not appropriate.
Some work situations, not appropriate.Really, though, having that attitude at work doesn't gain cooperation and respect, so I probably wouldn't use that tactic. With my young adult children - yes, it's appropriate in all cases.
Mhm. If you're equals then it fails. If you're an authority you can get away with it for the most part.
But is it really a question of whether you can get away with it or not? Is it okay/smart/effective if you can get away with it?
Posted by truecap
Depends on the relationships.If it's parents saying that to a 19 yo kid, then yes. My house, I'm paying the mortgage, the bills, buying the groceries, so my rules, if you don't like it then there's the door.
If it's a business, I'm responsible financially, my name is on the door, I've got the responsibility of making sure regulations are followed correctly, (OSHA, IRS, etc), then yes, if you don't like it you can leave.
If I'm a manager and my job is on the line, I won't allow your noncompliance to cost me my job, so you can transfer to another department or leave.
If it's friends, then no, it's not appropriate.
Some work situations, not appropriate.Really, though, having that attitude at work doesn't gain cooperation and respect, so I probably wouldn't use that tactic. With my young adult children - yes, it's appropriate in all cases.
Mhm. If you're equals then it fails. If you're an authority you can get away with it for the most part.
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The question was if an authority figure says it, right?
And I did say it wasn't appropriate in a friendship situation, because you are equals.
The first part I would never say ...."I'm never wrong." (Although probably accurate 😉)
However, I've said this quite often throughout life....."If you don't like my rule, then leave."
I trust me, and my opinion, more than anyone else's. Sue me. 😄
Posted by truecap
And I did say it wasn't appropriate in a friendship situation, because you are equals.
Correct.
I kinda see it both ways.
I mean it is true, a parents handles all the needs of the child, so refusing to obey them wouldn't/shouldn't be tolerated. The saying I'm always right and if you don't like it, leave, seems like an unfair power play more than discipline. Though it is true, they child could leave or would have incentive to leave if they had that much disagreement.
Of course if things did reach that point, the relationship would be damaged and contact would likely be cut. I remember hearing the stories my mother, aunts and uncles told of how my grandmother ran things.
So many beatings. They all left as soon as they could and I think all stayed away until she got sick, then a few came back to live in the same state. Some didn't.
I prefer the style where authority reminds inferior of how well they prospered under their command and just say the consequences they see if inferior does what they want over what the authority wants.
Put then there's the whole thing of patience and other variables that flare up. I don't think it be my style though, since if they picked that up from me, they could go tyrant on any power sap stuck under their rule in the future and then probably lose opportunity over the way they handle people.
Posted by truecap
Depends on the relationships.If it's parents saying that to a 19 yo kid, then yes. My house, I'm paying the mortgage, the bills, buying the groceries, so my rules, if you don't like it then there's the door.
If it's a business, I'm responsible financially, my name is on the door, I've got the responsibility of making sure regulations are followed correctly, (OSHA, IRS, etc), then yes, if you don't like it you can leave.
If I'm a manager and my job is on the line, I won't allow your noncompliance to cost me my job, so you can transfer to another department or leave.
If it's friends, then no, it's not appropriate.
Some work situations, not appropriate.Really, though, having that attitude at work doesn't gain cooperation and respect, so I probably wouldn't use that tactic. With my young adult children - yes, it's appropriate in all cases.
Children are more than capable of understanding... not always but for the most part. I think to be authoritative yet loving is needed in futile situations but the reasoning for being authoritative should not be financial power. Displaying the attitude of "I'm paying the mortgage, the bills, buying the groceries, so my rules, if you don't like it then there's the door" takes away empowerment and confidence with children.
The end does not justify the means. You can have the same ending but with a more reasonable justification... one that is less aggressive.
I think it is okay to enforce rules in a household but never because "your financial power" but rather for logical reasons that are beneficial for all family members. It is more important to teach VALUES rather than the power of money.
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When you have teenage children you will have a completely different perspective. Teenagers who think they run things, when they don't. When they try telling you how to run your household, it will not sit well with you. When I'm paying the bills, they do not have a right to call the shots. I call the shots, not them. For instance, my son tries to tell me how to spend my money - I set him straight right off.
And I know what I said sounds harsh and cold, but I'm really not that way for the most part. I'm pretty cool and take his thoughts and feelings into consideration. It's only when he gets a little big for his britches that I have to adopt that attitude.
I thought I better clarify. 🙂
Posted by SirHorns
Authority Figure: "I'm never wrong. If you don't like my rule, then leave,"...while I get it, I can also see the consequences of ruling like that. Naturally things will play out, no matter what, but how do you Caps feel about people who run business/friends/family/etc like that?
Saying one is never wrong might as well be no different then narcissism in a way. Even if one were to say if you don't like the rule then leave it'd still would've been stupid in a way for something that that person knows they're wrong for. It's like shooting your son or daughters tv and then killing their dog and telling them if they don't like it leave. I can agree somewhat, but everyone needs to know when they're in the wrong. Even I know this and address it commonly. If those rules of your place involve destroying someone else's property or using it to manipulate them into doing what you want them to do then that person is in the wrong and should probably be dealt with.
Posted by stillwat3r
... ok.... *cricket cricket*
Yup.
Ooo! I just realised that you can hide your posts! Niiice!🙂
Posted by stillwat3r
... ok.... *cricket cricket*Yup.
Ooo! I just realised that you can hide your posts! Niiice!🙂
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Why hide it? I like reading different viewpoints, especially if they're different than mine.
If I have a 19 yo living with me, sitting on my couch, eating my food, not helping out, wanting money for this and that, not working...then refuse to do chores, get a job, or assist in anyway in the runnings of the household...they can step up, comply and contribute the the family or they can hit the door.
That's the situation I was talking about happycapper.
Posted by SirHorns
Authority Figure: "I'm never wrong. If you don't like my rule, then leave,"...while I get it, I can also see the consequences of ruling like that. Naturally things will play out, no matter what, but how do you Caps feel about people who run business/friends/family/etc like that?
Saying one is never wrong might as well be no different then narcissism in a way. Even if one were to say if you don't like the rule then leave it'd still would've been stupid in a way for something that that person knows they're wrong for. It's like shooting your son or daughters tv and then killing their dog and telling them if they don't like it leave. I can agree somewhat, but everyone needs to know when they're in the wrong. Even I know this and address it commonly. If those rules of your place involve destroying someone else's property or using it to manipulate them into doing what you want them to do then that person is in the wrong and should probably be dealt with.
click to expand
Wow. That sounds so extreme!!!
But, you do hear about this kind of stuff on the news, when one of them shoots the other.
Posted by truecap
If I have a 19 yo living with me, sitting on my couch, eating my food, not helping out, wanting money for this and that, not working...then refuse to do chores, get a job, or assist in anyway in the runnings of the household...they can step up, comply and contribute the the family or they can hit the door.That's the situation I was talking about happycapper.
Amen, sister.
Posted by SirHorns
Authority Figure: "I'm never wrong. If you don't like my rule, then leave,"...while I get it, I can also see the consequences of ruling like that. Naturally things will play out, no matter what, but how do you Caps feel about people who run business/friends/family/etc like that?
Saying one is never wrong might as well be no different then narcissism in a way. Even if one were to say if you don't like the rule then leave it'd still would've been stupid in a way for something that that person knows they're wrong for. It's like shooting your son or daughters tv and then killing their dog and telling them if they don't like it leave. I can agree somewhat, but everyone needs to know when they're in the wrong. Even I know this and address it commonly. If those rules of your place involve destroying someone else's property or using it to manipulate them into doing what you want them to do then that person is in the wrong and should probably be dealt with.
Wow. That sounds so extreme!!!
But, you do hear about this kind of stuff on the news, when one of them shoots the other.
click to expand
Had a bad childhood. In over it and putting my cents in. The shooting and dog murder didn't happen but something close to one of those happened
Posted by truecap
If I have a 19 yo living with me, sitting on my couch, eating my food, not helping out, wanting money for this and that, not working...then refuse to do chores, get a job, or assist in anyway in the runnings of the household...they can step up, comply and contribute the the family or they can hit the door.That's the situation I was talking about happycapper.
That's what I thought. In fact I had very little against your post. My post was actually not specifically directed at you at all; I didn't hide my post because of opposing - or even same views. I hid them because there was absolutely no substance in them. The point I was trying to make was that there are always different situations and cases. I was writing examples of this in a way that I thought was really funny...when I wrote it. And then I read it again...aaand, nope it wasn't. Hence the hiding.🙂
People believe that a great ruler must rule with an iron fist. To me, being DOMINATE means understanding and teaching, rather than commanding or being stubborn because you know best. People that are control freaks or use ultimatums are straight INSECURE or lazy! I would let you fall on your face so that you learn, than pick you up to show you that I'm still here, care and explain why you fell in the first place because of the choice they made.
I know people mean well by doing this, but it's wrong because they do not offer free will or choice. If you do not let people fail, how can they grow or mature properly—
Posted by truecap
If I have a 19 yo living with me, sitting on my couch, eating my food, not helping out, wanting money for this and that, not working...then refuse to do chores, get a job, or assist in anyway in the runnings of the household...they can step up, comply and contribute the the family or they can hit the door.That's the situation I was talking about happycapper.
That's what I thought. In fact I had very little against your post. My post was actually not specifically directed at you at all; I didn't hide my post because of opposing - or even same views. I hid them because there was absolutely no substance in them. The point I was trying to make was that there are always different situations and cases. I was writing examples of this in a way that I thought was really funny...when I wrote it. And then I read it again...aaand, nope it wasn't. Hence the hiding.🙂
click to expand
Ohhh.okay. 🙂
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Authority Figure: "I'm never wrong. If you don't like my rule, then leave,"
...while I get it, I can also see the consequences of ruling like that. Naturally things will play out, no matter what, but how do you Caps feel about people who run business/friends/family/etc like that?