Damnata
@Damnata
15 Years25,000+ PostsVirgo
Comments: 252 · Posts: 36418 · Topics: 473
US Dating Scene..
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""I need a drink," were her first words after I introduced myself.
It was a rainy Thursday evening as we hurried into a lounge in Midtown Manhattan.
I met Julia through a mutual friend a week before. We were both immigrants to the USA, born in the same part of the world and emigrating around the same time. I viewed our similar backgrounds with great optimism since I wouldn't be meeting a stranger but someone who??d I be able to relate with, and vice-versa.
Julia, 25, 5??5", 100lbs, wearing black business clothes and black stilettos was the first to sit on a small cushion-like chair opposite of me.
We made ourselves comfortable, and right away I knew it was going to be "one of those dates." I knew I??d have to do most of the talking, and that I??d have to work to make her feel comfortable with me.
I began by telling her about me. I told her I like traveling, that I??ve lived abroad for many years in various exotic locales, met various people — some interesting, some boring, some who??ve changed my life. Even picked up a few languages along the way. Basically qualifying myself as someone remotely interesting and perhaps even making it worthwhile for her to be spending her precious time with me.
It got uncomfortable a few times. There's only so much talking and flirting I can do before it becomes forced. When I listened, she kept circling back to her work and how it makes her happy. Her eyes lit up when she recounted how she was given more responsibility due to the absence of her co-worker who was on maternity leave.
That was pretty much the only time her eyes glowed.
What becomes apparent very quickly with American women is that the most important thing to them is how how they feel. Maybe it's an artifact of the cut-through capitalism or a severe lack of emotional intelligence, but it is always the self that reigns supreme. Her emotional and physical state are what must be tended to at all times.
She's not trying to get you to like her. She's not relying on you for emotional support. She's not relying on you for financial support. She's using you as a vehicle for her own validation and empowerment.
Thanks to the feminist revolution and the battle against the "oppressive" males, she's is, for better or worse, your equal, and your job is to somehow make yourself useful — namely by delivering that validation and empowerment.
It was a rainy Thursday evening as we hurried into a lounge in Midtown Manhattan.
I met Julia through a mutual friend a week before. We were both immigrants to the USA, born in the same part of the world and emigrating around the same time. I viewed our similar backgrounds with great optimism since I wouldn't be meeting a stranger but someone who??d I be able to relate with, and vice-versa.
Julia, 25, 5??5", 100lbs, wearing black business clothes and black stilettos was the first to sit on a small cushion-like chair opposite of me.
We made ourselves comfortable, and right away I knew it was going to be "one of those dates." I knew I??d have to do most of the talking, and that I??d have to work to make her feel comfortable with me.
I began by telling her about me. I told her I like traveling, that I??ve lived abroad for many years in various exotic locales, met various people — some interesting, some boring, some who??ve changed my life. Even picked up a few languages along the way. Basically qualifying myself as someone remotely interesting and perhaps even making it worthwhile for her to be spending her precious time with me.
It got uncomfortable a few times. There's only so much talking and flirting I can do before it becomes forced. When I listened, she kept circling back to her work and how it makes her happy. Her eyes lit up when she recounted how she was given more responsibility due to the absence of her co-worker who was on maternity leave.
That was pretty much the only time her eyes glowed.
What becomes apparent very quickly with American women is that the most important thing to them is how how they feel. Maybe it's an artifact of the cut-through capitalism or a severe lack of emotional intelligence, but it is always the self that reigns supreme. Her emotional and physical state are what must be tended to at all times.
She's not trying to get you to like her. She's not relying on you for emotional support. She's not relying on you for financial support. She's using you as a vehicle for her own validation and empowerment.
Thanks to the feminist revolution and the battle against the "oppressive" males, she's is, for better or worse, your equal, and your job is to somehow make yourself useful — namely by delivering that validation and empowerment.
—
We moved over to share a couch with the hope that she??d feel more comfortable and loosen up a bit. She sat at the farthest end possible while I sat comfortably in the middle facing her.
In Brazil, you usually get physical with a girl quickly (usually within an hour of meeting her, sometimes even quicker). Kiss just comes so naturally, like a handshake and is no big deal.
While Brazil is definitely at the extreme, things are not radically different in other parts of the world. In Central and Eastern Europe, while a kiss is a bigger deal, comfort is built much, much smoother and quicker. Maybe its the constant scare-mongering in the US media that makes people more isolated and less eager to connect.
In Ukraine, we??re usually best friends within an hour, enjoying our company, making future plans, etc.
In America, things are more like chess game. Each "opponent" waits the other??s calculated move. And each move has to have a perfect balance of aggressiveness and aloofness.
Making plans for a second date on the first? Too desperate. Not going for a kiss at the right time? Not aggressive enough.
Date #2
I invited her for some Spanish tapas the next weekend. My idea was to take her to an environment where I can break through her shield and see the real her, hopefully getting her to open up a bit more.
I told her about my multiple visits to Spain and the kind of tapas they have there. I told her that I have a good friend living in Barcelona whom I??ve visited few times, and how beautiful the city really is. I also told her how funny Spanish accent from Spain sounds and how people make fun of it in Latin America. She seemed interested but couldn't relate; she has never traveled outside the US since coming here twelve years ago.
As we sat down she told me that she has duly researched the restaurant the night before and checked all the reviews. She even had ideas as to what to order. I asked her if she??d ever go into some hole next door without checking out the reviews before hand. She said she??d never do it at the risk at that place having awful food.
After the restaurant, I invited her to a Cuban bar in the East Village. We sat at the bar and ordered mojitos.
I sat next to her, facing her with our knees and legs touching. She was still holding back, playing it cool, and acting like a prize feeding on my flirting and innuendos.
We moved over to share a couch with the hope that she??d feel more comfortable and loosen up a bit. She sat at the farthest end possible while I sat comfortably in the middle facing her.
In Brazil, you usually get physical with a girl quickly (usually within an hour of meeting her, sometimes even quicker). Kiss just comes so naturally, like a handshake and is no big deal.
While Brazil is definitely at the extreme, things are not radically different in other parts of the world. In Central and Eastern Europe, while a kiss is a bigger deal, comfort is built much, much smoother and quicker. Maybe its the constant scare-mongering in the US media that makes people more isolated and less eager to connect.
In Ukraine, we??re usually best friends within an hour, enjoying our company, making future plans, etc.
In America, things are more like chess game. Each "opponent" waits the other??s calculated move. And each move has to have a perfect balance of aggressiveness and aloofness.
Making plans for a second date on the first? Too desperate. Not going for a kiss at the right time? Not aggressive enough.
Date #2
I invited her for some Spanish tapas the next weekend. My idea was to take her to an environment where I can break through her shield and see the real her, hopefully getting her to open up a bit more.
I told her about my multiple visits to Spain and the kind of tapas they have there. I told her that I have a good friend living in Barcelona whom I??ve visited few times, and how beautiful the city really is. I also told her how funny Spanish accent from Spain sounds and how people make fun of it in Latin America. She seemed interested but couldn't relate; she has never traveled outside the US since coming here twelve years ago.
As we sat down she told me that she has duly researched the restaurant the night before and checked all the reviews. She even had ideas as to what to order. I asked her if she??d ever go into some hole next door without checking out the reviews before hand. She said she??d never do it at the risk at that place having awful food.
After the restaurant, I invited her to a Cuban bar in the East Village. We sat at the bar and ordered mojitos.
I sat next to her, facing her with our knees and legs touching. She was still holding back, playing it cool, and acting like a prize feeding on my flirting and innuendos.
Another thing you quickly learn about American women is their complete mastery of sarcastic expressions. Julia??s favorite was adding a disclaimer of "just don't get too excited" every time she uttered anything remotely sexual.
Maybe it was the third mojito, but I admit she looked sexy that night. She carried herself with that black skirt and stilettos that even at some point she was worth the asking price in terms of all those games she was making me put up with just for me to get closer. Maybe reading "The Rules" and all those magazines were paying off for her, and that even a moderately attractive girl like her can become several points more desirable just by applying few techniques in flirting and body language.
As the night progressed, she was getting more flirty, smiling, playfully touching me and asking me more personal questions.
I continued flirting and then just looked into her eyes and paused. She gave the usual sarcastic reply, trivially downplaying my slowly escalating flirting, but started to grow uncomfortable. I didn't say a word and kept looking, our eyes fully locked, waiting for her reaction, like a predator carefully stalking their prey.
She grew more uncomfortable even starting to ask me logical questions, a common technique to throw off any escalation — a complete one eighty degree turn from her previous flirtation self.
I didn't flinch.
Feeling the tension rise, she began to feel self-conscious, lost in the interaction, unsure and unable to counter my advances.
And just like that it was gone. I took my eyes off her and stared outside to the right, towards the window. Like on cue, she began to re-compose herself, slowly regaining her artistic ability to crack witty questions and sarcastic remarks.
But it was all over. It was just fa?ade; the empress had no clothes after all.
Then it all made sense, and I knew exactly with whom I was dealing with.
The harsh reality is that there can be only one Madonna, Lady Gaga, Shakira, or that slutty girl from Sex and The City, but because they??re such huge brands, there??re millions of women trying to emulate them with the understanding that that's how women should behave. Maybe there's a market of men who love to be with a girl who carries herself like she just walked off the set of a popular sitcom. (In fact there has to be some demand otherwise they??d be a lot of lonely, depressed and disappointed women.)
Maybe it was the third mojito, but I admit she looked sexy that night. She carried herself with that black skirt and stilettos that even at some point she was worth the asking price in terms of all those games she was making me put up with just for me to get closer. Maybe reading "The Rules" and all those magazines were paying off for her, and that even a moderately attractive girl like her can become several points more desirable just by applying few techniques in flirting and body language.
As the night progressed, she was getting more flirty, smiling, playfully touching me and asking me more personal questions.
I continued flirting and then just looked into her eyes and paused. She gave the usual sarcastic reply, trivially downplaying my slowly escalating flirting, but started to grow uncomfortable. I didn't say a word and kept looking, our eyes fully locked, waiting for her reaction, like a predator carefully stalking their prey.
She grew more uncomfortable even starting to ask me logical questions, a common technique to throw off any escalation — a complete one eighty degree turn from her previous flirtation self.
I didn't flinch.
Feeling the tension rise, she began to feel self-conscious, lost in the interaction, unsure and unable to counter my advances.
And just like that it was gone. I took my eyes off her and stared outside to the right, towards the window. Like on cue, she began to re-compose herself, slowly regaining her artistic ability to crack witty questions and sarcastic remarks.
But it was all over. It was just fa?ade; the empress had no clothes after all.
Then it all made sense, and I knew exactly with whom I was dealing with.
The harsh reality is that there can be only one Madonna, Lady Gaga, Shakira, or that slutty girl from Sex and The City, but because they??re such huge brands, there??re millions of women trying to emulate them with the understanding that that's how women should behave. Maybe there's a market of men who love to be with a girl who carries herself like she just walked off the set of a popular sitcom. (In fact there has to be some demand otherwise they??d be a lot of lonely, depressed and disappointed women.)
Personally, I don't settle for anything less than the real thing, and thankfully, I'm usually pretty good at judging who is and isn't.
It was all over. There's nothing she could??ve said or done that could??ve changed it. This time it was me that gave her a window of opportunity but like a deer caught in the headlights she fumbled and fell exposing her lack of social and emotional intelligence.
Date #3
I reluctantly made plans with her the following weekend and not the one to cancel, agreed to see her again. Instead of meeting in Manhattan, she offered to pick me up, with a proclamation that "on weekends, I drive."
Her generous act of offering to pick me up felt less than something nice one does for another but more of her declaration of independence validating her womanly role in modern society.
She picked me up, and asked where we are going. Feeling completely uninspired, I told her it was her choice. So, like a good American girl, she suggested the movies.
That right there is why I travel. To learn other cultures, talk to other people, and get other perspectives on life. I want to know that there's something more this world can offer me than going to see some mass produced product in some generic mass produced franchised venue with some generic person shaped by mass produced popular culture.
In Brazil, the most gorgeous girl I met in my life begged me to spend the night with her on the beach the night we met. She enjoyed meeting me and didn't want the night to end. We fooled around on the sands of one of the most well-known beaches in the world laughing, smiling, kissing all while trying to communicate in any way possible.
A French girl invited me to check out a museum for a gallery she was curious about. She was the stereotypical French girl of how you imagine French girls: snobbish yet sophisticated. I loved that about her. She told me that Paris was too snobbish and that I should go to Toulouse or Bordeaux instead.
A Colombian girl took me to her favorite bar in a working-class neighborhood where I was the only foreigner. She ordered for me, introduced me to her friends, and made sure I had a good time.
A Lithuanian girl showed me around her city, showing me some monuments of important people while proudly explaining me the history of her small country.
A Czech girl showed me Prague like few tourists get to experience, ending in a local bar with the best beer I??ve ever had.
It was all over. There's nothing she could??ve said or done that could??ve changed it. This time it was me that gave her a window of opportunity but like a deer caught in the headlights she fumbled and fell exposing her lack of social and emotional intelligence.
Date #3
I reluctantly made plans with her the following weekend and not the one to cancel, agreed to see her again. Instead of meeting in Manhattan, she offered to pick me up, with a proclamation that "on weekends, I drive."
Her generous act of offering to pick me up felt less than something nice one does for another but more of her declaration of independence validating her womanly role in modern society.
She picked me up, and asked where we are going. Feeling completely uninspired, I told her it was her choice. So, like a good American girl, she suggested the movies.
That right there is why I travel. To learn other cultures, talk to other people, and get other perspectives on life. I want to know that there's something more this world can offer me than going to see some mass produced product in some generic mass produced franchised venue with some generic person shaped by mass produced popular culture.
In Brazil, the most gorgeous girl I met in my life begged me to spend the night with her on the beach the night we met. She enjoyed meeting me and didn't want the night to end. We fooled around on the sands of one of the most well-known beaches in the world laughing, smiling, kissing all while trying to communicate in any way possible.
A French girl invited me to check out a museum for a gallery she was curious about. She was the stereotypical French girl of how you imagine French girls: snobbish yet sophisticated. I loved that about her. She told me that Paris was too snobbish and that I should go to Toulouse or Bordeaux instead.
A Colombian girl took me to her favorite bar in a working-class neighborhood where I was the only foreigner. She ordered for me, introduced me to her friends, and made sure I had a good time.
A Lithuanian girl showed me around her city, showing me some monuments of important people while proudly explaining me the history of her small country.
A Czech girl showed me Prague like few tourists get to experience, ending in a local bar with the best beer I??ve ever had.
The American girl suggested we go see a movie.
—
After the movie, while we were having Sushi, she told me she wanted to ask me some questions. When I thought my night can't get any worse, she duly pulled out her blackberry and began asking me a series of well thought-out questions that she designed to satisfy her great curiosity about me:
"What are your strengths?"
"What are your weaknesses?"
"Where do you see yourself in 5 years"
She viewed our interaction as job interview, explaining that like in job interviews our ultimate goal is to sell ourselves, and that's what I should be doing.
So what you??re saying is that you don't have enough emotional intelligence to satisfy those questions via other means and therefore must resort to explicitly asking me such questions with the hope that my answers would help you come to certain conclusions about me?
Interesting. All I knew that there's no way I??d buy anything she's selling because there would be absolutely no value in it whatsoever.
Sure, I could??ve thought of some clever answers to seem more desirable in her eyes, but why bother. I long began to view myself as an observer, perhaps as a marketing researcher, psychologist or a social scientist who was experimenting with some newly found human specie — Woman Americanus.
I was no longer in seduction mode but more interested in satisfying my curiosity by reverse engineering her behavior and see why and how it all came about.
Surely she was normal once?
—-
When you meet an American girl, what you??re really meeting is the walking and talking brand represented by thousands of hours that were spent marketing, advertising and selling to her and her demographic. That girl who sits next to you on the B train in Manhattan wearing skinny jeans, a nice fitting leather jacket, high heels, and carrying a Louis Vuitton bag is a live advertisement representing a handful of corporations that have won the battle for her heart and mind.
Furthermore it's not only her tastes in fashion that were carefully constructed and molded, but more importantly her mind as well.
What's left is a shell of her former self. She learns how to interact with men through magazines, mass media and relationship websites. She dates online, flirting and rejecting candidates from the comfort and security of her laptop.
—
After the movie, while we were having Sushi, she told me she wanted to ask me some questions. When I thought my night can't get any worse, she duly pulled out her blackberry and began asking me a series of well thought-out questions that she designed to satisfy her great curiosity about me:
"What are your strengths?"
"What are your weaknesses?"
"Where do you see yourself in 5 years"
She viewed our interaction as job interview, explaining that like in job interviews our ultimate goal is to sell ourselves, and that's what I should be doing.
So what you??re saying is that you don't have enough emotional intelligence to satisfy those questions via other means and therefore must resort to explicitly asking me such questions with the hope that my answers would help you come to certain conclusions about me?
Interesting. All I knew that there's no way I??d buy anything she's selling because there would be absolutely no value in it whatsoever.
Sure, I could??ve thought of some clever answers to seem more desirable in her eyes, but why bother. I long began to view myself as an observer, perhaps as a marketing researcher, psychologist or a social scientist who was experimenting with some newly found human specie — Woman Americanus.
I was no longer in seduction mode but more interested in satisfying my curiosity by reverse engineering her behavior and see why and how it all came about.
Surely she was normal once?
—-
When you meet an American girl, what you??re really meeting is the walking and talking brand represented by thousands of hours that were spent marketing, advertising and selling to her and her demographic. That girl who sits next to you on the B train in Manhattan wearing skinny jeans, a nice fitting leather jacket, high heels, and carrying a Louis Vuitton bag is a live advertisement representing a handful of corporations that have won the battle for her heart and mind.
Furthermore it's not only her tastes in fashion that were carefully constructed and molded, but more importantly her mind as well.
What's left is a shell of her former self. She learns how to interact with men through magazines, mass media and relationship websites. She dates online, flirting and rejecting candidates from the comfort and security of her laptop.
She reads articles that explain everything from when to return a guy??s call to when is the right time to sleep with a guy.
She thinks that being overly sarcastic is sexy, and that being distant and unattainable drives men wild.
She has no personality, no originality and no femininity.
She's a workaholic, trying to progress career-wise in the face of continuing "male oppression." She also has a chip on her shoulder, using any opportunity to prove that she's in control by whipping out the credit card as soon as the bill comes and doing anything she can to prevent you from paying.
—??
If there's one thing I love more than women is seducing them.
I love seducing Mexican, Brazilian, Colombian, Russian, Lithuanian and Argentinian women.
American women, on the other hand, are not seducible. You can't seduce American women.
You can get them drunk and have sex with them in the club??s bathroom, but that's not seduction.
They won't make you grow. They won't inspire you. They won't teach you new things you don't already know.
After getting home, the first thing I did was devise a plan of yet again leaving this country for far greener and inspiring lands.
Source: http://mavericktraveler.com/the-land-of-the-free-and-home-of-the-soulless-uninspiring-and-robotic-women/
She thinks that being overly sarcastic is sexy, and that being distant and unattainable drives men wild.
She has no personality, no originality and no femininity.
She's a workaholic, trying to progress career-wise in the face of continuing "male oppression." She also has a chip on her shoulder, using any opportunity to prove that she's in control by whipping out the credit card as soon as the bill comes and doing anything she can to prevent you from paying.
—??
If there's one thing I love more than women is seducing them.
I love seducing Mexican, Brazilian, Colombian, Russian, Lithuanian and Argentinian women.
American women, on the other hand, are not seducible. You can't seduce American women.
You can get them drunk and have sex with them in the club??s bathroom, but that's not seduction.
They won't make you grow. They won't inspire you. They won't teach you new things you don't already know.
After getting home, the first thing I did was devise a plan of yet again leaving this country for far greener and inspiring lands.
Source: http://mavericktraveler.com/the-land-of-the-free-and-home-of-the-soulless-uninspiring-and-robotic-women/
Posted by MissFisk
Did they meet on OKCupid?
Probably? Or POF/Match.com/Others. Idk
Posted by MissFisk
And why does your avatar look like a Victorian painting?
Thank you
Posted by MissFisk
The US is a pretty conservative country. You go to school, get a job, get married, buy a house with a picket fence and watch your grandchildren play on the front yard when you're 70. I think that's what the "romanticized ideals" that are sold here. While that seems to work for some, those who have higher expectations on romance and passion (like dude-man above), these will definitely fall short.
click to expand
I see. The vibe I got from the article in describing the dynamic had nothing to do with conservative mindsets or romanticized ideals. The human interaction seems forced/contrived/unnatural. Dude's bias is obvious either way.
Interesting article...
Posted by Damnata
I
Does this article ring true in what you see around you and the experiences you had?
Rings very true more often then not, especially where he talks about the chip on the shoulder.
I've traveled some, and the difference is stark.
Sounds the the NYC dating scene. Every date was like reading off a resume...
Posted by Kodak375
Oh absolutely, american women are a unique brand all on their own. Its hard to be feminine yet still aspire to be more dominant than men in multiple facets. It seems alot of american women have "male ego" in order to be an assertive figure, but end up losing one of the most important parts of themselves, their softness.
+1
WHO wrote this shit?
I immediately disliked the author when he started bashing on feminism because it made women equal and dating less fun for HIM.
The example he used- someone to help "validate" and "empower," like how dare women even expect men to fill such a role- is effing hilarious, considering in the 50s that was a woman's primary role to a man- validate and empower him. Help him get his job, make his home presentable, raise his kids, all so HE'D look good for the boss and in the eyes of society. But a woman does it now and it's a hindrance on dating?
But considering he's from Braseeeel, it explains a lot about HIS attitude.
It just sounds like he's mad he didn't get laid or get a hard on as easily as he'd hoped based on a shallow first impression he'd made. "OMG WE'RE BOTH FROM THE SAME COUNTRY AND MOVED HERE. LET'S DATE." Sorry your choice in women is so strange, dude.
I mean I can't blame him for making the connections, but I think he'd built up an image of who she should be before they went out and he ended up sorely disappointed.
Then, he stares her down in some creeper manner and then considers it "done" because she's wtf about his sudden staring at her like a freak? He's one to talk about "emotional intelligence."
I also love the examples he used of women in other countries- the French chick that put out immediately and the other chicks who ordered for him (yet he has issue when the American chick insisted on paying), showed him around, etc. I know women who do the things that he gave examples of. I also know some that are quite dull like the example that he gave. Sounds like his ego can't cope with the fact that his ego isn't getting stroked how he'd like.
However, the point about dating here being a pool of shallow idiots isn't that far off. While I know dating, as a whole, is a cluster fuck since we have created a society of self centered sociopaths, it boils down to both sides dating for the sole purpose of what the other person can DO for them. Not "hay I like you," but "what can I get from you?"
I immediately disliked the author when he started bashing on feminism because it made women equal and dating less fun for HIM.
The example he used- someone to help "validate" and "empower," like how dare women even expect men to fill such a role- is effing hilarious, considering in the 50s that was a woman's primary role to a man- validate and empower him. Help him get his job, make his home presentable, raise his kids, all so HE'D look good for the boss and in the eyes of society. But a woman does it now and it's a hindrance on dating?
But considering he's from Braseeeel, it explains a lot about HIS attitude.
It just sounds like he's mad he didn't get laid or get a hard on as easily as he'd hoped based on a shallow first impression he'd made. "OMG WE'RE BOTH FROM THE SAME COUNTRY AND MOVED HERE. LET'S DATE." Sorry your choice in women is so strange, dude.
I mean I can't blame him for making the connections, but I think he'd built up an image of who she should be before they went out and he ended up sorely disappointed.
Then, he stares her down in some creeper manner and then considers it "done" because she's wtf about his sudden staring at her like a freak? He's one to talk about "emotional intelligence."
I also love the examples he used of women in other countries- the French chick that put out immediately and the other chicks who ordered for him (yet he has issue when the American chick insisted on paying), showed him around, etc. I know women who do the things that he gave examples of. I also know some that are quite dull like the example that he gave. Sounds like his ego can't cope with the fact that his ego isn't getting stroked how he'd like.
However, the point about dating here being a pool of shallow idiots isn't that far off. While I know dating, as a whole, is a cluster fuck since we have created a society of self centered sociopaths, it boils down to both sides dating for the sole purpose of what the other person can DO for them. Not "hay I like you," but "what can I get from you?"
Posted by CapricornLaurie
Sounds the the NYC dating scene. Every date was like reading off a resume...
It has to be. I don't know anyone who handles dates like that. But I live on the other coast where the lifestyle here is far different than NYC.
...which makes his article even more laughable. He criticizes her for not being as travelled as he is, yet his article only has experience from a city with a totally unique culture compared to other parts of the country.
I also don't understand why he qualifies her as an American woman when she, just like he has, moved here from Brazil.
Sorry, there's just too many flaws in this dude's logic. Let him go back to Brazil where he can get his dick sucked on command. He's ridiculous.
He has some truth to his opinion about American women but generalizing us is not so good we are all different depending on what states we are from. This guy just wanted to get laid while she was trying to see if he was husband material taking things slow. I believe his argument was about not living in the moment and interviewing him for a potential relationship.
Yes we do strategize and play chess games with men but we didn't learn it from magazines and the media we learned it from men. Men are hunters and often play head games so to understand them magazines, blogs, and the media came up with go to guides to beat them at their own game. To make them earn our mind and body versus them thinking they can manipulate a woman's emotion for their physical needs just to avoid commiting to a woman.
It's not old fashion like it use to be the dating game is modern now so we are forced to play chess when it comes to dating.
I agree and disagree with some of the things he was saying. I don't find anything wrong with a woman being independent and can take care of herself. We don't need to continuously feed a males fragile ego to feel needed. A lot of times you see the women that depend too much on a man get mistreated by them. So if he wants to mock feminism than he should know that men have forced us to become more self sufficient and what came from it is them appreciating and valuing us more.
Yes we do strategize and play chess games with men but we didn't learn it from magazines and the media we learned it from men. Men are hunters and often play head games so to understand them magazines, blogs, and the media came up with go to guides to beat them at their own game. To make them earn our mind and body versus them thinking they can manipulate a woman's emotion for their physical needs just to avoid commiting to a woman.
It's not old fashion like it use to be the dating game is modern now so we are forced to play chess when it comes to dating.
I agree and disagree with some of the things he was saying. I don't find anything wrong with a woman being independent and can take care of herself. We don't need to continuously feed a males fragile ego to feel needed. A lot of times you see the women that depend too much on a man get mistreated by them. So if he wants to mock feminism than he should know that men have forced us to become more self sufficient and what came from it is them appreciating and valuing us more.
Posted by Kodak375
I think you guys are missing his point which men born and raised in this country have slowly noticed for yearsssss. People are judging and being defensive and not realizing their needs and connections are NOT being fulfilled due to entitlement, mind games, and necrotic robotic behavior to fit a role.
Yeeeaars?
You're 20. So since you were, what, 10 you noticed all these complex dating issues?
You speak of judging and that is all this guy did in all 3 instances he gave on his date. He's equally guilty of the things he accuses women of doing.
Harsh and defensive words not necessary? I'm pointing out at what a load of garbage the whole thing turned into because he wrote it poorly. As Ands pointed out- he sounds like a tourist. He kept pointing out all the conquests he's had since he's SUCH the traveller. Oh so experienced in the ways of the world, and he proceeds to discuss sexual conquests and women that did all these things for HIM on dates.
Yes, he IS pompous, and that said, he has no business writing an article about the state of American dating until he has more information and a better way of presenting the data.
I guess you also missed the point that I made at the end of my comment. No need to defend the pompous idiot, dear. While I do understand the overall point, the whole article was written terribly, full of logical fallacies, and he gave a little insight in how he views womens' roles in his life.
I think the author is definitely in NYC. I'll play devils advocate and say he's not so much attacking feminism and this woman's dryness but more the fact that most Of the US dating scene involves trying to get to know each other while wearing an emotional mask.
He just couldn't crack her and see what made her an individual, all he could see was the marketing that shaped her expectations and her routine.
I find that a lot of people here try to fit into a role and its very much about what you do for a living, where you live, who you know. If two people can fit into a specific role, they are compatible.
He just couldn't crack her and see what made her an individual, all he could see was the marketing that shaped her expectations and her routine.
I find that a lot of people here try to fit into a role and its very much about what you do for a living, where you live, who you know. If two people can fit into a specific role, they are compatible.
The mistreatment of women is bad all around the world. If she gives in to intimacy early you don't want to date her if she doesn't then she's self righteous with entitlement issues.
It is all a chess game until you have found the one that's meant for you. Men are guilty of playing this game just like women. I'm sorry I used the wrong term not "forced to" but more so as learning from expierence on how to properly deal with men so they won't take advantage of a woman's softness and emotions. The men in this ear is not traditional in courting a woman they won't easy access so women have to be SMART and observe a man's true intentions.
Anyway this is all opinions on a forum no one should be taking anything personally or starting arguments.
It is all a chess game until you have found the one that's meant for you. Men are guilty of playing this game just like women. I'm sorry I used the wrong term not "forced to" but more so as learning from expierence on how to properly deal with men so they won't take advantage of a woman's softness and emotions. The men in this ear is not traditional in courting a woman they won't easy access so women have to be SMART and observe a man's true intentions.
Anyway this is all opinions on a forum no one should be taking anything personally or starting arguments.
I'm just sitting here trying to think if I know that Cuban restaurant because I can remember walking pass a few in the LES...the woman in the article deff has NYC swagg though...yup that's how we are sometimes.
**ERA
Posted by Damnata
I met Julia through a mutual friend a week before. We were both immigrants to the USA, born in the same part of the world and emigrating around the same time. I viewed our similar backgrounds with great optimism since I wouldn't be meeting a stranger but someone who??d I be able to relate with, and vice-versa.
Right here, already created an image of who she was and what he expected between them.
We made ourselves comfortable, and right away I knew it was going to be "one of those dates." I knew I??d have to do most of the talking, and that I??d have to work to make her feel comfortable with me.
Again, more assumptions and making things up on his side of things, thus determining the outcome already.
I began by telling her about me. I told her I like traveling, that I??ve lived abroad for many years in various exotic locales, met various people — some interesting, some boring, some who??ve changed my life. Even picked up a few languages along the way. Basically qualifying myself as someone remotely interesting and perhaps even making it worthwhile for her to be spending her precious time with me.
Sorry, but if I was out on a date with a guy who talked about himself immediately, I wouldn't know wtf to think besides "wow, so full of himself." It's one thing to throw out a snippet of info to get the ball rolling, but he essentially said here- "I'm so great and amazing!" My question is, was she really lacking substance or was she trying to figure out wtf to do since he dominated the conversation and the date from the get go?
It got uncomfortable a few times. There's only so much talking and flirting I can do before it becomes forced. When I listened, she kept circling back to her work and how it makes her happy. Her eyes lit up when she recounted how she was given more responsibility due to the absence of her co-worker who was on maternity leave.click to expand
Soo... his talking about his travelling and things HE was into was okay, but her work is what SHE'S into and loves and suddenly it's a bad thing? I know it can seem kind of womp womp, but double standards, yo. He's a douche for looking down on her for loving her job and being excited about it.
cont-
t like that she doesn't have as much to talk about as he does and she's about her work, he should have called it quits after the first date. With his outlook, it sounded like he was dragging it out to see if he could at least get some sex out of her.
What becomes apparent very quickly with American women is that the most important thing to them is how how they feel.
So women are supposed to be autonomous and put out on random whims like he likes to do? I'm not quite understanding wtf his point is here or why he thinks he has the place to state as much.
She's not trying to get you to like her. She's not relying on you for emotional support. She's not relying on you for financial support. She's using you as a vehicle for her own validation and empowerment.click to expand
"She doesn't need me in a way that makes me feel good and like a big ol' strong man *grunt grunt*." See my point in reference to 1950s women.
Don't get me wrong, I get the point and it's equally shitty for women to deal with as well since guys are all about self and what they want. Like I said, dating anymore is about "what can you do for me?"
I just don't think this guy is the one who should be writing about the state of American dating scene when he has zero experience in the arena and his attitudes reek of typical archaic bullshit that's still prevalent in latin American culture.
Posted by Octoberbaby91
The mistreatment of women is bad all around the world. If she gives in to intimacy early you don't want to date her if she doesn't then she's self righteous with entitlement issues.
It is all a chess game until you have found the one that's meant for you. Men are guilty of playing this game just like women. I'm sorry I used the wrong term not "forced to" but more so as learning from expierence on how to properly deal with men so they won't take advantage of a woman's softness and emotions. The men in this ear is not traditional in courting a woman they won't easy access so women have to be SMART and observe a man's true intentions.
+1
This thread is hot right now. Its really interesting to see other peoples take.
I think the author is a Libra. Constantly balancing and comparing to determine if this woman is worth dating. He also is very talkative. He enjoys talking about love since he made the effort to write this article. At least definitely an air sign.
I think the author is a Libra. Constantly balancing and comparing to determine if this woman is worth dating. He also is very talkative. He enjoys talking about love since he made the effort to write this article. At least definitely an air sign.
Back to Damnata's question in relation to the article- the point that's made that essentially sums up that people are shallow and stupid?
Agreed. Both are guilty of this. As to when this has started- I'm not sure. I know some in their late 30s who cannot hold a convo for shit, but I know a whole lot more who are younger that suffer severe social retardation thanks to social media- cannot hold a convo with any sort of substance unless it involves reality TV or something with grunting a few syllables.
But this is the state of our culture- something that has been groomed within us for decades intentionally.
I don't see it just in dating, but in every day conversation with people. If you want intellect, start weeding. It's getting harder to find.
Agreed. Both are guilty of this. As to when this has started- I'm not sure. I know some in their late 30s who cannot hold a convo for shit, but I know a whole lot more who are younger that suffer severe social retardation thanks to social media- cannot hold a convo with any sort of substance unless it involves reality TV or something with grunting a few syllables.
But this is the state of our culture- something that has been groomed within us for decades intentionally.
I don't see it just in dating, but in every day conversation with people. If you want intellect, start weeding. It's getting harder to find.
Posted by CapricornLaurie
This thread is hot right now. Its really interesting to see other peoples take.
I think the author is a Libra. Constantly balancing and comparing to determine if this woman is worth dating. He also is very talkative. He enjoys talking about love since he made the effort to write this article. At least definitely an air sign.
It's funny that you say that because I was about to mention that I'd dated someone who sounded like this guy, and he was a Libra. Especially the parts where he talked fully about himself to prove he was worth her time.
The guy I knew was constantly telling me things that made him sound good, as if he were trying to impress me. I was amused but at the same time it was a peek into who he really was- someone trying to seek validation via all his experiences.
The reaction he (and this author wanted) "OOOH WOW. REALLY? I AM SO IMPRESSED. THIS IS AMAZING. YOU ARE SO WORTH MY TIME. HERE, LET ME DROP DEM PANTIES FOR YOU!!"
The point of the article wasn't missed, it was just overshadowed by some total douchebaggery in the process.
@rockyroadicecream yeah definitely a libra. I love how he kept dating her even though he knew it wouldn't work.
Similar experience with a Libra I dated.
Similar experience with a Libra I dated.
Libra men are drama queens that explains his exaggeration on his expierence.
^^^ my brother *rolls eyes* that's why we are always fussing.
The guy who wrote the article found a articulate way to tell a story about how she didn't let him hit.
The guy who wrote the article found a articulate way to tell a story about how she didn't let him hit.
Posted by Sugarfoot
LOL! hold up... how are we so certain dude is a Libra? LOL. I would have guessed Leo or Aries based on my dating experiences with them.
I don't think a libran guy would have been crass enough to write that a man can seduce a woman by getting her drunk and banging her in the bathroom.
Sure he would. 😛
Sounds like she's trying to be some megafeminist, and failing
miserably. :/
HOWEVER
He was trying to seduce her.
Only.
And he failed miserably, too.
Soo... maybe a Leo Moon?
To answer, though, no-- but Manhattan is so different from
well... the rest of the country.
Maybe that's how it is there. :/
Posted by Sugarfoot
LOL! hold up... how are we so certain dude is a Libra? LOL. I would have guessed Leo or Aries based on my dating experiences with them.
I don't think a libran guy would have been crass enough to write that a man can seduce a woman by getting her drunk and banging her in the bathroom.
...yes he would. They ARE male, after all. Don't substitute yourself in place for the male variant of your sign. You are not the same.
The way some guys talk around you =/= how they talk around the guys or when writing about how dating is from the male perspective, remember that.
Posted by Montgomery
Sounds like she's trying to be some megafeminist, and failing
miserably. :/
This is the sad part though- I see this so much anymore. SO much shallow bs going on in society. It's always been there throughout history, but it seems with this sudden worship of sex tape "stars" and their affiliates gives you status in the world for doing, well, nothing. ...aside from being trashy enough to make a sex tape.
So we have a lot of people focused on the wrong things in life- appearances. No substance. I see it SO much where I work. It's a nicer restaurant and you get people coming in, dressed nice (many don't, which is another discussion), but ZERO manners, tact, any of it. It seems as if a decade of putting trash up on a pedestal has misdirected people's goals in life. You can LOOK like you have money/class, but you're likely in debt up the ass on 10 credit cards. You can wear all those insta glam designers, but it doesn't mean you carry the class that goes with those brands.
So now you have women who go around thinking they're classy, but they're really trashy, vapid bitches.
You have guys who think status is all about money and cars and that'll get you the girl- then they become jaded and blueball cranky because they didn't get the vag they thought they deserved with such shallow tactics, like this fool.
I think it's sad he was immediately judging her, and not from just pure observation, but with criticism. Because she didn't fit his tourist ideal, he looked down on her for enjoying her job. Note that he never specified what the convo was about other than him and her being excited about her job. He looked down on her because she couldn't keep up a convo with him. All in all, he blamed everything on her and used her as a primary example of American "women," when all that is to be seen is yet another guy who's pissed off that he didn't get the pussy he thought he deserved because he graced her with his presence.
He can claim that American women/the dating scene is purely American, but he's acting very much like all the American dudes we have to put up with- trying to fend for ourselves in a sea of guys whose likely motive is to get laid.
"WAAAH SO GUARDED" Then stop trying to fuck anything with a pair of boobs that moves, Jesus.
Posted by busyeyes88
@OP. I have to say it was very interesting reading this. Thanks for that! I'm British but have travelled to 18 countries and visited 60 locations and love meeting people of different races, countries, culture!! I've visited the US many times and have relatives living there. Where are you from? Have you ever been to the UK? What is your sun sign? I'm taurus.
I'm Romanian. I've been to the UK once when I was really really young.
I'm a Virgo.
Where I'm trying to get at with this article..I don't focus on him or her or if he scored or not.
While I was reading it the other night, I had visions of dxp relationship topics. It's a majority of Americans on this site so I was wondering if the things I cannot relate to in those threads are normal and part of the way dating unfolds in the States. So if people give their opinion about this article, I can gauge a little better. You notice patterns after a while and things that are implied but never stated in a culture. I've noticed that one of the first reactions people have to topics is to assume that one party is playing games with another. That part in the article where he talks about a chess game is exactly how those topics come across to me.
I'd like to contribute more but since I don't live there, it's really interesting reading all the replies.
While I was reading it the other night, I had visions of dxp relationship topics. It's a majority of Americans on this site so I was wondering if the things I cannot relate to in those threads are normal and part of the way dating unfolds in the States. So if people give their opinion about this article, I can gauge a little better. You notice patterns after a while and things that are implied but never stated in a culture. I've noticed that one of the first reactions people have to topics is to assume that one party is playing games with another. That part in the article where he talks about a chess game is exactly how those topics come across to me.
I'd like to contribute more but since I don't live there, it's really interesting reading all the replies.
^^^^ a sample can never represent the whole. be it that report, be it dxp, be it dxp male or female.
And after we have collected millions of samples we can't say a thing about what happens when we meet an american.
Even the Gaussian normal distriubtion is pregnant cause there are average, extem above average, extrem under average etc.
Yet your OP is interesting. cause it makes waves and we like this kind of daily distraction. otherwise who would come to dxp?
And after we have collected millions of samples we can't say a thing about what happens when we meet an american.
Even the Gaussian normal distriubtion is pregnant cause there are average, extem above average, extrem under average etc.
Yet your OP is interesting. cause it makes waves and we like this kind of daily distraction. otherwise who would come to dxp?
^lol @ makes waves.
I enjoy seeing the different perspectives on it.
I read an article of his about a Romanian chick too. I can't identify personally but I can see that dynamic.
I enjoy seeing the different perspectives on it.
I read an article of his about a Romanian chick too. I can't identify personally but I can see that dynamic.
"I've noticed that one of the first reactions people have to topics is to assume that one party is playing games with another. "
I think it is because most of the active dxpers are water and earth.
My virgo-cancer-scorpio sister is living in Europe but she plays so much games with the guy she dates that I could cry for the guy's pain.
No wonder that http://astromatrix.org/Astrology/BirthChart gives this for her:
Releasing the need for truth in art,
All about me,
The Challenger,
Searching for Answers,
Me against You,
Wasting energy,
The Spy,
DeStructure or ReStructure,
Emotional Confusion,
Yourself against Others.
I think it is because most of the active dxpers are water and earth.
My virgo-cancer-scorpio sister is living in Europe but she plays so much games with the guy she dates that I could cry for the guy's pain.
No wonder that http://astromatrix.org/Astrology/BirthChart gives this for her:
Releasing the need for truth in art,
All about me,
The Challenger,
Searching for Answers,
Me against You,
Wasting energy,
The Spy,
DeStructure or ReStructure,
Emotional Confusion,
Yourself against Others.
Oh man, I saw that topic. I got so many contradictory titles. At least "The Spy" sounds cool.
She's a Virgo Sun? if so..UGH! smh @ her.
She's a Virgo Sun? if so..UGH! smh @ her.
That's a high maintenance transplant.
I hate dating because of all the rules, cliches, ego, expectations. I'd rather just hang with my friends.
I hate dating because of all the rules, cliches, ego, expectations. I'd rather just hang with my friends.
Posted by Damnata
Where I'm trying to get at with this article..I don't focus on him or her or if he scored or not.
While I was reading it the other night, I had visions of dxp relationship topics. It's a majority of Americans on this site so I was wondering if the things I cannot relate to in those threads are normal and part of the way dating unfolds in the States. So if people give their opinion about this article, I can gauge a little better. You notice patterns after a while and things that are implied but never stated in a culture. I've noticed that one of the first reactions people have to topics is to assume that one party is playing games with another. That part in the article where he talks about a chess game is exactly how those topics come across to me.
I'd like to contribute more but since I don't live there, it's really interesting reading all the replies.
I found interesting some of the reactions here interesting, like the focus on the individuals rather than the point the author was trying to get at, sprinkled IMHO with hints of defensiveness and dismissal.
The latter I am suspecting is coming from commenters in the US.
Whether the guy is a douche or not (he sounds like one of those pickup artist types) and whether chick is a vapid cold fish or not aside, the article does touch on a dynamic I've seen. And it's not limited to NYC.
I think there is a mixture of narcissism, unrealistic expectations, and laziness when it comes to dating in the US and it does get reinforced by the current culture.
If I were that guy in the scenario, that first date would have been extremely short.
Just a bunch of women posing slutty. Showing as much body as they can, and sticking their nasty tongues out. Why the fuck is your tongue white? Clean the plaque off your mouth dumb hoe. Or is that cum stains? Like what does she want? Is she saying she wants dick or cum on her face?? That's the impression I get. And wtf is up with women who post double pictures of themselves? Are they that arrogant that one slutty picture isn't enough? They need an inverted picture of the same picture next to it? And then we have the fatties that are just as arrogant as the dimes. Look at me, I'm morbidly obese and proud of myself. That or they take pictures of just their face hoping you miss the double chin. Stop it! Nothing to see here, move alone.
Rant over.
Rant over.
This article is invalid.
He first said she was an immigrant. Then he calls her an American woman. I don't think it's the same correlation. If she is an immigrant, then she was not brought up with the same background and ideals as other American women out there.
He first said she was an immigrant. Then he calls her an American woman. I don't think it's the same correlation. If she is an immigrant, then she was not brought up with the same background and ideals as other American women out there.
Posted by truecap
This article is invalid.
He first said she was an immigrant. Then he calls her an American woman. I don't think it's the same correlation. If she is an immigrant, then she was not brought up with the same background and ideals as other American women out there.
Am I really the ONLY one who caught this?
He's bashing American woman based on a woman who's not even American by birth. His entire theory has no basis.
Yes, Rocky caught on to it. I didn't notice until after I posted.
Posted by FrostAndBitePosted by truecapPosted by truecap
This article is invalid.
He first said she was an immigrant. Then he calls her an American woman. I don't think it's the same correlation. If she is an immigrant, then she was not brought up with the same background and ideals as other American women out there.
Am I really the ONLY one who caught this?
He's bashing American woman based on a woman who's not even American by birth. His entire theory has no basis.
I think someone else commented on this?
I noticed it. But I also put in context the emphasis of Manhattan. Manhattan is this sort of cultural vortex. So while his logic is faulty, I can still see his point. That being 'even this immigrant who I am expecting to bond with based on non-Americaness has been swallowed up by said culture and changed.'
Though like I said, a tad too ego-centric. The dude, while having some interesting and valid thoughts, obviously believes in himself a little too much. I look at it like a baby and bath water type thing.click to expand
Ahhh....I didn't think about that point of view.
Of course, everybody wants to have —ideal sweetheart??! But it's —tale?? for children, and we won't have it in the real life! Women like stories about —princes in the saddle?? and reading —wimpy novels??! Therefore women —lose the feeling of reality??! But, I think that all men are very good and kind! The most important is to find approach to him!) Men??s mission is to love and —protect?? their loved women!) And only then we??ll have perfect harmony in this world!) I can advise to men excellent site https://mymagicbrides.com/ where you will find your —real love?? or —good company/best friend??!) We must communicate with each other, exchange opinions and our energies!) Love is —symbol?? of our bright future!) I wish everyone to meet —fate?? and be very happy!)
I feel as though this guy went into dating with certain assumptions/expectations, maybe even biases. Expectations will often lead to disappointment.
Honestly, I didn't see anything wrong with the things the girl was doing. They can all be seen in an acceptable light if looked at from a different perspective. The culture here is different than Brazil, France, etc. The guy seemed to think the girl was playing some type of game or going by a rule book, but maybe she was just going by what's more comfortable for her? Maybe she doesn't like seduction. Maybe she's looking for someone who matches her work-oriented life. The guy seemed to be the one looking to play a game to me. He was trying to get laid and his tactics weren't working. So, instead he got upset and decided that the girl was playing games. Everyone has different boundaries and relationship needs. The guy isn't wrong for wanting to get laid and the girl isn't wrong for taking a less emotion-driven route. But, you can't hate on each other when two people with different goals are brought into a situation together. They should have realized that they wanted different things and moved on from there. No negative blog post necessary.
I don't know. Maybe this rant has nothing to back it up, but that's these are my impressions.
Honestly, I didn't see anything wrong with the things the girl was doing. They can all be seen in an acceptable light if looked at from a different perspective. The culture here is different than Brazil, France, etc. The guy seemed to think the girl was playing some type of game or going by a rule book, but maybe she was just going by what's more comfortable for her? Maybe she doesn't like seduction. Maybe she's looking for someone who matches her work-oriented life. The guy seemed to be the one looking to play a game to me. He was trying to get laid and his tactics weren't working. So, instead he got upset and decided that the girl was playing games. Everyone has different boundaries and relationship needs. The guy isn't wrong for wanting to get laid and the girl isn't wrong for taking a less emotion-driven route. But, you can't hate on each other when two people with different goals are brought into a situation together. They should have realized that they wanted different things and moved on from there. No negative blog post necessary.
I don't know. Maybe this rant has nothing to back it up, but that's these are my impressions.
I suppose I should add that I have no idea whether her stance is 'American' or different from other countries' styles. Never been out of the country. In my age group, people are more focused on the lay than a long-term relationship, so I can't even say that I personally see this more logic-driven approach to dating in my own area.
If that's a Libra I'm staying away.. the woman sounds like a Taurus.. taking this slow and asking the right questions long term wise, getting familiar with the guy ..Because if there really isn't any common interests, and maybe observing behavior of the guy's intention, then why would she open her legs to that douche.
The American people have standards. Everyone has a preference..
The American people have standards. Everyone has a preference..
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