A SIMPLE QUESTION ABOUT IMMIGRANTS (Page 2)

"It is important to keep things in perspective."

Let me help you a bit in straightening this perspective - If you are living with say 200 million people belonging to one community, some ( quite a few in fact, at present there are 800 terror cells in India ) members of which make it a habit to plant 20-30 bombs in different cities every year which then kills around 100 and maims many - How do you propose to live without this irrational fear ? Of course you can't brand the whole community as supporting terrorism - that would be outrageous I know. But you can always sense a wave of underlying sympathy towards religion and itz supremacy. And many of them wouldn't even realize this explicitly since itz drilled into their sub-conscious. One of my good educated Muslim friend was actually sad and glad at the same time when 9/11 happened.

SB, I prefer to stay politically correct because before writing anything here, I have think of my Muslim friends ( here and in real life ) - I dont care if I offend them, but I dont want to hurt them 🙂

Not that I didn't make it amply clear SB. But I really can't say that I have a problem with Indian Muslims - because am still not clear about my own position on this issue and hence it can't be explained. Itz quite tenuous U see. And not that my Muslim friends come here to read my posts - just that I normally try not to be double-faced to the extent possible.

"although letting that fear manifest itself into unfairness and prejudice would be very disappointing"

Absolutely. And U see how unavoidable this trap can be, though ? And U would have assumed 9/11 to be a perceived threat before it actually happened.

Actually SB , more that having a problem, I think am frustrated with the attitudes of Indian Muslims ( and this is mostly perceived ). Because perhaps I expect them to behave and be like us since uniformity of identities will mitigate the unease. In fact even the Muslims are frustrated for the same reason because they may be expecting the same from the others.

Some of Ur ideas are excellent but still utopian - and I conform to them as well. But honestly, U can't make a mountain talk to a mound easily. What do U exactly propose to tolerate btw ?

Now come on Angel u honestly think a gov't wld be politically correct to accomdate one particular grp like the Muslims?

Hardly not realistc. Db asserted his own assumption based on his own feeling on the subject.

The truth of the matter ppl have been persecuting one another on the basis of religion for centuries. Perhaps the cultural diversity was meant to teach us. Tolerance and Learning about war and how our own fears mask any potential peace.

I personally find hate a waste of energy and actually feel bad for ppl who live their lives in such uglieness.

Pd

*cappy looks on peacefully*

Hi AquaAqi!!!!!!!!!!!! 😄

Dancing bread

1 I am not sure what I have ever done to you to dislike me but tooche I hardly even gave u a thought so whatever.see me as you may. I am not a prejudice person whatsoever even to ppl who don't share my opinion

2 the scripture was for dogsbody who believes in Christian faith. You were not even a thought.

As for facts I just don't go around hating on ppl for the simple reason of their differences. Someone has to do something factually to offend me before I form a negative opinion on them.even than I don't carrying around hate for them.

The question to you why r u so critical of me? What have I said to offend you?

Generally I find ppl who hold others in negative frame of mind suffer from some deep seated self-esteem issues. It is much easier to tlk negatively about others than it is to look at ones own issues.

I have a meetin to run to I will be back.

Pd

"but which races do you see demonstrating in the streets calling for the death sentance for someone that happens to say something that offends them—
Certainly no "Love" there!!
When was the last time you saw "White Europeans" standing in the streets calling for the death sentance for someone??
And just as an example, it wasnt Fair Skinned Europeans that were responsible for Sept 11 or the London Bombings, its always the "SAME" races."

The outright STUPIDITY of this comment, makes it obvious his argument stems from EMOTIONS...FEAR being the main one.

Well Ms Pisces - answer the question ?
when WAS the last time you saw thousands of white europeans calling for the death penalty—??

My argument is against people who come to western countries and expect everything to be handed to them on a plate, have no intention of assimilating and expect us to bow to them and learn their ways "WHY?"
As previously stated, if i were to go to China (as an example) id at least have the courtesy to learn the basics of the language, and i wouldnt expect them to have to pay for me through their taxes either.
I watched (as many other Australians did) a TV Doco and a group of young muslim guys openly bagging western culture and western ways "we will never assimilate with these people) and that was a Direct Quote from one of them. Another Direct Quote "western women deserve what they get if they dress like that" referring to "Rape"
Excuse Me!!!
Who the hell do they think they are, then they wonder why nobody likes them.

once again, lets use the "Racism" banner to make DB sound like a monster!!
I think ive made my feelings known, and once again, ive heard NOTHING to covince me otherwise.
And no, im not a racist freak who shouts obscenities or gives funny looks at people who dont look the same as me.
Im one of the friendliest people youll ever meet, have helped many people in many situations.
If someone goes to another country with the full intention of making a better life, getting a job, doing their bit for the community "YAY"
They arent the ones im talking about!!!!!!!!

xun2 - I realize that some of the people participating in this discussion are not in the U.S. but I am so, I am referring to what I actually know and have seen; thank you for pointing that out though in case I didn't - I mean that sincerely - there are far too many people here that hear an opposing view point and go on the attack. I appreciate someone who has the ability to disagree without making outlandish personal attacks 🙂

PD - maybe dogsbody was assuming...maybe not.... we don't know - but I didn't just defend the christmas comment, I gave an example that proves that governments ARE that politically incorrect....a court of law decided that a muslim family was right to complain about having to listen to someone else sing happy birthday to someone else in a restaurant...ridiculous.... if they were somewhere where they forced to listen to it and couldn't leave, and or were forced to join in then I can see complaining....but to go to a restaurant and then sue the company for singing happy birthday...come on.... and it was upheld by a court of law - that's government.

"PD - maybe dogsbody was assuming...maybe not" Perhaps so, but I really doubt it .....based on common sense......


If anything I have learned from this topic. Cultral Diversity is more complex than imagined. It is not like a pot of stew where you throw in some carrots, peas, potatoes .....and voila.

For whatever reason some of us are more culturally finiky than others. Too bad because one can miss the different flavors of life.

Alas ......I am just one person, what do I know?

PD

I don't think the idea was that cultural diversity itself was a bad thing... he opened by saying people who hate [his] country should have stayed where they came from, and it turned into an argument about other things. I still stand by my agreement with the OP - if you don't like the culture in the country you're immigrating into then go home.... if you do like it then by all means join!

Not to say that all immigrants are terrorists - but there certainly are people who come to this and other countries with the intention of doing something like the 9/11 attacks.... and while it is true we have our own home-grown crazies.... we certainly don't need to add to the pot....

HOWEVER, I don't like the state of fear in this country right now and it's a tough place to be - having to weigh the rights and freedoms of people against their safety....what to do what to do.....

I don't want crazy terrorists in my country - but there is no simple solution to stopping it AND maintaining liberty......

"I don't want crazy terrorists in my country - but there is no simple solution to stopping it AND maintaining liberty......"

Right—

Do you think we can kick George W Bush out of the United States— Gawd knows we failed miserably at impeaching him. 😢

PD

now there's an idea....well okay we might not need to kick him out.... just make sure he's heavily supervised so he doesn't hurt himself or anyone else.... 😢

well...okay maybe just not anyone else..... 😉

Id feel a lot safer living next door to George Bush
than the leaders of Iran or China (their names escape me lol)

but technically he didn't kill the soldiers who went to war...he just sent them to their deaths....living next do to him has nothing to do with it.

Interesting post! I agree with DB about respecting the host country, culture and all. But his comment "When was the last time you saw "White Europeans" standing in the streets calling for the death sentence for someone??" is outright STUPID!

No one can justify the barbaric acts of 9/11 or London bombing but where this rage came from?!? Why this rage of Middle Eastern people against Whites?!? Have you ever thought about it? Look around to see the remnants of damage America did around the world. As much as Americans are 'concerned' about Kuwait being invaded by Iraq, what they did with Palestine?!? Do you think America would have bothered about Kuwait if not for oil— Applying the same yardstick why not Americans rage a war on Russia for invading Georgia? (I am not into who is right or who is wrong in Russia Georgia spat). They won't dare to because Russia will kick their ass! You were not in Iraq or Palestine to know what they go through. So don't say their hatred is stupid.

About the 'civilized' western world, who did the ethnic cleansing of Jews? Who colonialised the whole world to claim that Sun never sets in their Empire? And do you think English treated the people of their colonies with 'respect'?!? Who used Japan as their testing ground for atomic bomb— Who enforced Apartheid in South Africa— Is it necessary for a 'civilized' White to ridicule the prophet of their religion? And now they are uncivilized because they want him dead?!? Where is your brain?!?

Lets face it. We whites did enough damage to every other race. They faced your music so don't complain when it is our turn. It's better to look at the dirt in your back before complaining about others.

"We whites did enough damage to every other race."

To be honest - that seriously happened centuries ago and to an extent over the last few decades as well. Western world's domination did some good things and some bad - diminished the confidence of others to believe in themselves ( in stead of building it ) but at the same time exposing them to good things in life - enhanced living standards, health,education, technology etc. to name a few. And again, such injustices continue to happen indigenously as well - on scales macro and micro.

What do you assume - that Middle Eastern ppl aren't racist ? They probably are of the worst kinds - hence you see so many ethnic conflicts. What do you think - that South Asians aren't parochial ? In India ppl are still driven by insane casteist mindsets, though the barriers are gradually crumbling. They would still fall into the category of hypocrites - demanding world justice/equality with a rotten backyard.

Whatever happens, happens - give ppl a chance coz that sounds like what most religions/cultures anyways prescribe. And frankly, religion is just a rope which prevents ppl from falling into an abyss - it never was subscribed to in full,earnest and required seriousness and it never will be. We just cling on to our tags and identities because only a few have the courage to be truly born - You were always born into a few key categories and you never had a say about it. Now how human is that ?

"To be honest - that seriously happened centuries ago and to an extent over the last few decades as well."

Not exactly. Hitler is from last century! South Africa is from last decade!! Whatever good things that happened in the invaded societies are collateral effects or spill overs.

I know. Racists are everywhere and it's not specific to White community. Being in SA, I know that better! That doesn't give us a reason to portray others as barbarians while our behavior is no good to write about!

bb...your reasoning is a bit circular.....people in history hurt other people, so those people have a right to hurt their descendents and the descendents shouldn't complain....therfore, THEIR descendents [or even now] have a right to exact revenge on the people exacting revenge on them now?? The "eye for an eye" law is antiquated.......

@xangelfishx...it wasn't meant to sound that way. I don't believe in revenge, more so in revenge by descendants. I got wound up by the post which portrays the picture of white men the best and rest are a step below. Believe me, if we don't mess up with them in Middle East and made their life horrible, we won't be sitting now in fear! When you have the luxuries of life, there won't be civil unrest and resorting to terrorism. Even in Middle East, the rich gulf countries don't have this problem. Look into the civil wars of Africa. You never know how western world will behave if they don't have money. So it's better not to accuse others sitting in high pedestal.

Cusp of Power - It's not appeasing Cusp. It is reasoning. Just because I am at the receiving end will not change the facts. Ignorance and Arrogance wont change anything.

Xun2 - Some Saudis are lured by the misplaced ideology. It's more like America and Israel. Your example on Taliban was spot on! Both Taliban and Saddam Hussain were nurtured by America to counter then Soviet Union. World politics is a very dirty game and everyone plays it to their interest without bothering about collateral damage.

The one thing we call all agree on .....this most certainly is not a simple question. Wow this has been some topic.

PD

There are those who bring in yesterday to shape what you have today - And then there are others who look at tommorrow to bring that back to order.

The world is still half and half!!
Half of it is Civilised and half of it is Not
You CANT bring them both together

Thats the million dollar question Moon Eyes :-)

Yeah, take take take, and how do they repay you—
Well, we wont go down that road again!!!!