A New Scorpio on board....

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Scorpio209
@Scorpio209
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 8 · Topics: 2
Hi my names Abe from stockton, Ca. I read alot of messages from and to other scorpios on this site and i just wanted to introduce myself. We all usually end up getting in some type of problem, and this site seems very usefull. So if anyone needs any advice, i'd be gladly to help and i hope to be treated the same way. Anyways I was born in October 23, 1985. My Sun sign is in Scorpio as well as my Mercury, Pluto and Saturn. And my moon sign is in Pisces and venus in Libra. And the rest im not really concerned with. I been reading about general astrology for a couple years and I love sharing this information with people who have no knowledge in this field. Well i hope we can all get along. And as for you haters.....please just stay in your own territory, dont go around saying stupid things about a scorpio when you nothing about a scorpio. i say this because i read some stupid remarks from other signs about scorpio which really made me upset. I believe im an all-Scorpio as can be and very proud of it. I treat other signs with respect and expect the same. I only registered here to make friends with some fellow scorpio's and other signs for help and advice. Well take care....
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Scorpio209
@Scorpio209
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 8 · Topics: 2
Ok, sorry i just cant hold it in any longer. I thought I could just ignore it but you know what, the truth must be said. Now as for you Miss Cancer lady....you stated, " Scorpios are only good for head...Otherwise they have small penises & cum fast. Yech!", just what in the Hell gave you the nerve to say that. Tell you the truth, i only registerd because i read what you said, and it just boiled me up. We Scorpio's are the King's when it comes to Sex. Yes i said Kings!!! Theres two sides of us, a scorpio and an Eagle. U must not have been fucking a Scorpio, Because a scorpio like me would of have ripped your pussy apart and thrown you in the gutter for saying something like that. I would never intend to just hurt someone's feelings you made the mistake for saying such words. So let that be a lesson to you. Its only going to make you wiser and stronger, for you particularly, Cancerian, no nothing about us Scorpios. So stay in your postion.
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Tiamat
@Tiamat
20 Years1,000+ PostsScorpio

Comments: 0 · Posts: 4267 · Topics: 82
Welcome to the boards.Not a basher but another scorpio.Is there anything good about this sign that isn't the intently driven and sexually related positives.Im always confused when im supposed to be some overemotional,cruel,noncompromising,powerfull beings while im one of the most passive and patient people alive.I shocked the hell out of an employee today when I told him I was getting stressed out because I didn't show any signs of it.It's only when it's something bigger than just me when I do sit up and argue but I also have aqua in whatever that warrier sign thing is so it could be just that.I don't like other people being treated badly and unfairly,doesn't matter whether it's other peoples doing or thier own insecurities doing the harm something will be said.Did you find anything that would classify this as usual scorpio behaviour or am I just a freak that can't be classified as a scorpio.
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19Eleven
@19Eleven
20 YearsScorpio

Comments: 0 · Posts: 227 · Topics: 18
Scorpio209 Welcome!

I understand your anger about that post mentioning private member of one self in derogatory manner. Ofcourse if the said lady knew that a known scorpio was watching she would be more considerate. I would say at the best that post desrves to be where it belongs to- garbage can. Just treat it with the famous scorpion indifference. Ofcourse unless you are looking for some drama. We scorpions know what we are. There is no need for us to advertise ourselves.LOL

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haffo
@haffo
20 Years5,000+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 9826 · Topics: 354
Actually these words of yours, Scorpio209, reminds me someone. It reminds me myself. Actually a part of myself that tends to come out here and there. I used to stop that side, because most of the time I see that most of the people dont like to deal with that part of me. But as you see, I used a word above "used to", because now I know that this is not the part that I only have. Others have it too. I have realised that this part is just a thing of preference for people. Somes dont accept, but somes do.
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softy
@softy
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 1234 · Topics: 79
That was really vulgar..Scorpios are not the bad, but u have to have thick skin to put up with one and you have to be ready...personally...I was sooooo intrigued by the one I liked....and now that I figured him out.....it was nothing so great about him in the first place.......They are not all that mysterious as people make them, including myself. I don't care what anybody says....they are a** holes....just like cancers are moody and cranky.....Scorpio's are a** holes....that the only way to decribe them.....even my daughter is a little a** hole most of the time.....
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Alana
@Alana
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 1857 · Topics: 45
"Now as for you Miss Cancer lady....you stated, " Scorpios are only good for head...Otherwise they have small penises & cum fast. Yech!", just what in the Hell gave you the nerve to say that. Tell you the truth, i only registerd because i read what you said, and it just boiled me up".

First off, Scorpio 209 - a warm welcome to the board....we enjoy meeting and interacting with all the new kids on the block- and glad to see how passionate you are in your post:-)

You've a lot to learn about our Ms. Cancer Lady..........lots of what she says is real tongue in cheek stuff......
"So let that be a lesson to you" you say to her - I don't think so!!!! - knowing Cancer lady - she'd be the one teaching us so many lessons in lots of different departments and areas of our lives!!! - every which way!!!:-) blah blah and so all your "pussy" gutter language doesn't impress me anyway so far.....you immediately lose respect and classiness when you choose to use nasty, vulgar language to attack anyone so personally on this board.......

"We Scorpio's are the King's when it comes to Sex. Yes i said Kings!!!" - oh god no!!!eh, I think that might be a sweeping generalization now, don't you!!!! Anyone who has to boast how good they are from the rooftops just doesn't cut the grade!!!Now me, I could say I am Queen when it comes to sex...but modesty forbids:-)!!!!!!

Anyway, once again welcome and ciao for now!!!!

a x
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Scorpio209
@Scorpio209
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 8 · Topics: 2
Dear Fellow Scorpios and other Neighbors. I have read what you said, thought it over and now its my turn to speak. You see my ignorant friend, we scorpios are one of the most patient and sophisticated individuals. I personally hate dramas and avoid getting into any type of conflict, therefore have been and remain a loner, but never a loser. A scorpio is no Loser, remember that. U see ..... the average person see's thing, feels things etc at almost the same level as next person. But Scorpio's, we feel things at such a deep deep level, the last thing we want is someone to hurt our feelings. Because these powerfull emotions work both ways. For the best and worst. We make the best allies or the worst enemies. Now going back to the situation.... I dont really care how others see me in there point of view. You say you have lost respect for me....but you see... I have lost respect for almost all man-kind already. So you have alot of more expierencing to do, to lost respect for people. So until you get on my level, Slow your Role a bit...I never in my entire life have ever ever picked on someone, or looked for a fight or any drama. But the minute someone starts somthing with me, and i know its not my fault, I'll be damn sure my scorpio sting paralyzes you, Litertaley. We are very respectfull individuals, but we get angered quickly if we sense fault or someone disrespecting us. Now me personally, i resemble an Eagle at the moment. So once you start seeing things at such a high level, you'll know what im talking about. And i dont really have time for superficial people, and have much things to accomplish. But at the same time, I Proudly Represent A True Scorpio till my last dying breath. And i will always be there to help another fellow Scorpio in trouble. Because I personally witnessed and understand how are nature is, and how emotional, sensitive we are. I have been hurt soo much in the past that i hate even reminding myself, because the snake and scorpions will burst out of me in such with such a fierce that its just a site you do not want imagine. So my advice is to let us remain our Eagle nature, and dont tick us off, when we tend to cause no harm. Well there is alot more to be said, by im getting late for work. Well take everyone, no harm feelings... and haters...just stay away.
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patron
@patron
20 YearsScorpio

Comments: 0 · Posts: 90 · Topics: 4
For scorpio209

I do respect you and your attitude of being a scorpio and it is also clear that you have studied our zodiac quite well, however i also fell responsible regarding to your ways. Yes It is true that, what cancerlady has said is not good. But you seems to forget one more side of every scorpio, which is the lizard. Cancerlady's attitude is completely unacceptable for us who are stinger and eagle, but if she happen to meet the lizard then her opinion is true. Please be more patient. And in respond to "We Scorpio's are the King's when it comes to Sex. Yes i said Kings!!!" well you should not bragged that one (although I do believe it as well) because theres no way we could prove it unless the lady's in here would actually let you go through thier panty's after what you said.

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seizeTheDay
@seizeTheDay
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 2255 · Topics: 55
Hello and welcome to the boards Scorpio209,

I generally come on the boards, not speaking for all women or all Aries- rather for myself. Don't get me wrong, I've tossed in the occassional (some virgos do this, or some pisces are like that, and I wish I could get rid of my initial, "Blame his Star Sign" posts...) BUT overall, I take the people I meet here as the individuals they are..

On the same side of the coin- as some others have said- generalizations (particularly the truly negative ones) can basically be ignored. At the very least I have learned that my zodiac is only a small part of who I am- regardless of what have and will be said about all Aries out jest, spite, or ignorance.

SO! 🙂 If you truly are here to make friends, let me be the first to say, "hello!"

However, I would say, it would be easier if you didn't enter the room a $ $ -first.


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Sea Siren
@Sea Siren
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 1 · Posts: 4444 · Topics: 44
Jeez...take a chill pill. Just because the scorpio Cancerlady was with was lousy in the sack, doesn't mean you all are. Thicken up that skin. She is, after all, entitled to her opinion and should be able to express it without being verbally attacked in such an irrational manner by someone who doesn't even know her. There are people who don't care for Scorpios..just as there are some who don't care for Virgos, Pisces..etc., but we all speak from our personal experiences. If you're expecting everyone on this board to censor their negative experiences with scorpios for your benefit, I think you'll be sorely disappointed.
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Scorpio209
@Scorpio209
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 8 · Topics: 2
Hey hows it going everyone. Thanks for the responses. Well first i want to say, ok, i may have over did it. So I do appologize. And i did feel bad about it, but you see it wasnt really my fault, its the inner person inside of me, my negative scorpion side, its just very difficult to explain. You see, I actually like all water signs because i know how emotional we tend to be, and how sensitive we are, therefore i respect all water signs. My moon sign is Pisces with a sun Scorpio, and alot of other scorpio planets, but you know then how emotional i can be. Now u see...the way i see it, we water signs should always stay together, because we know eachother better than any other sign. Other signs only see and know us to a certain level, and they can hurt our feelings easily by pushing the wrong buttons. So the last thing We need is to compete with eachother. The way i see, if a person competes with you, he's no friend but an enemy. And you know how we Scorpios handle our enemies. Now n Days i think people should walk around with their Zodiac Symbol on the forehead, lol, that way we know who were dealing with. But anyways, well im sorry for the harsh words, but please dont ever make such a nasty remark about all Scorpio's, especially coming from a water sign, because that only wants to make me aband every other sign besides Scorpio. Now as for the positive things, lets just all stay cool with eachother, and if anynone needs my advice of any sort, im definetely willing to help, and i hope the same from others. You see....I try so hard to resemble an Eagle and stay that way, but theres people out there that just say things that just crush your feelings and its brings out the Dark side of my Scorpion Nature with such a vengence , which makes it very difficult for me to control, and afterwards i always end up feeling guilty. But i just wish people would let me remain an Eagle but thinking before they speak. Because every word effects my emotion in some way, either good or bad. well anyways, theres just soo much about us Scorpios, that we just dont find it safe to mention. But anyways, you guys take care....
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Alana
@Alana
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 1857 · Topics: 45
"You say you have lost respect for me....but you see... I have lost respect for almost all man-kind already. So you have alot of more expierencing to do, to lost respect for people. So until you get on my level, Slow your Role a bit..."

Eh, sorry Scorpio209, but I honestly don't want to get "to your level" - I chose never ever to lose respect for anyone - it's unconditional postive regard always always always, even if I don't agree with anyone.......certianly I may see them as flawed at this particular moment in time in a certain area of their lives...but who isn't!!!!

I prefer to remain "Ms. Average" - if my mind thought like yours and I felt so superior to others.....I think I might need go to counselling!!!!:-)

Lighten up, you are no better or no worse than anyone.....you are you....but you certainly ain't superior to anyone else on this board or on this planet!!!

Now Mister...have a good day and keep stinging!!!!:-) - you'll go a long way.

A x
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Alana
@Alana
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 1857 · Topics: 45
I actually didn't see your second posting until now Scorpio209 - and in it you now come across as a much, much nicer guy - you have explained yourself well - I was reacting to your earlier "superior" post before that.

So, maybe if you are THE EAGLE, I could fly perched on top of your feathery wings and then I might be able to see things from the lofty highs of the land of scorpio-dom:-) - I'm a cute bird!!! - and I like to go for rides:-)

ciao my pal.

Ax
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Storm
@Storm
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 152 · Topics: 8
Welcome scorpio209... My dear man, don't waste your stinger on fruitless ventures such as people's personal truths. That was cancerlady's experience, yes, it was a generalization but we all have a tendancy to do that to others from time to time. Try taking that perspective into account, see all sides of the spectrum before losing your sense of humor. One of the toughest lessons to learn as a scorpio is not to take things so seriously. Only then can you become the eagle that rises above challenges.
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patron
@patron
20 YearsScorpio

Comments: 0 · Posts: 90 · Topics: 4
Well for tiamat

The lizard which also consider the third and somewhat the worst type of a scorpio. Although not as many would encounter them, they are actually premature scorpio's who would not retaliate(I mean not capable to hurt anyone), they also boast to much on everything and live thier life according to what others tell them. In short a complete nonsense and more likely to be a push-over or simply the worst person you could actually meet.
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Sea Siren
@Sea Siren
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 1 · Posts: 4444 · Topics: 44
Ah, much better, 209. It is difficult not to defend your sign when you feel it is being attacked (lord knows I've done it enough on the Pisces board), but we usually keep it on an intellectual level so there are no hard feelings. Or we try to anyway. After all, what's the point if we just call each other names? We won't learn to understand each other any better. 😉 Welcome.
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vonblonde
@vonblonde
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 13 · Topics: 2
welcome from one scorpio to another. It is true we are very sensitive and emotional and even though we can easily communicate their still is some stuff we do not reveal about ourselves and our feelings, but watch out one a person betrays a scorpion,ouch the sting will last a long,long time my friend and their will be vengeance.... it is also true a scorpion is always willing to help someone in need to a degree.
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Libragirl
@Libragirl
20 Years500+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 813 · Topics: 55
Well, first of all, i will make it clear that it is a free world (for the most part) and i will say what i like! And Scorp 209 or whatever your name is, you can say what you like also, which you already have. Just a few things i would like to point out about your first "bad" post, before you redeemed yourself with your "nice" post:

"You see my ignorant friend": Well, this just smacks of arrogance. Until you have ultimate knowledge, do not assume that anybody is ?ignorant?.

"sophisticated individuals": yep, saying you are going to rip somebodies "pussy" out is really sophisticated...

"I personally hate dramas": Well, thus far, you've done everything to avoid a drama haven't you?

"the average person see's thing, feels things etc at almost the same level as next person. But Scorpio's, we feel things at such a deep deep level": Oh, and you're feelings are so much more important than everybody elses?! How do you know? You made all these accusations in your first post that nobody should make assumptions about scorps, well, this is what you are doing now.


"the last thing we want is someone to hurt our feelings. Because these powerfull emotions work both ways. For the best and worst": I guess i would tend to agree with this.

"So you have alot of more expierencing to do, to lost respect for people. So until you get on my level?": I think the only level here is delusion and i do not want to experience that.

"So once you start seeing things at such a high level": I kind of feel like i already do

"I have been hurt soo much in the past that i hate even reminding myself": Well, we all get hurt, but the important thing is to learn and to heal

"dont tick us off": This all seems a little conditional to me. So, people have to censor themselves when they are around you? The truelly wise person realises that true strength is in compassion, not in tyranny

"and haters": What is a hater? Somebody who expresses their opinion?

Now, secondly, apology accepted.

"So I do appologize. And i did feel bad about it, but you see it wasnt really my fault, its the inner person inside of me". Why is it never a scorpios fault?! It seems about every scorpio i know has rarely accepted responsibility for their actions. When it?s us ?mere? mortals, we certainly know about it?

"The way i see, if a person competes with you, he's no friend but an enemy": I actually tend to disagree with you here. I think that the most challenging situations and friends are usually best for our growth, or else they are just agreeing with us and are perpetuating what could already be faulty thinking.

"Now as for the positive things, lets just all stay cool with each other": At last, some rationality

"I try so hard to resemble an Eagle": I'm sure you will make it, i cna see that you are conflicted.
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Tiamat
@Tiamat
20 Years1,000+ PostsScorpio

Comments: 0 · Posts: 4267 · Topics: 82
Actually I have scorpio in my 11th house and it says and does unfortunatly happen to be true is that I like arguements with intelligent people to learn stuff,but I am willing to pull them aside and tell them if they actually get upset.Then with the sag rising it makes it worse so I will ask questions mainly to see if someone else has something different to say,kinda the reason I bug cancerlady with some stuff i've already mentioned before,she finds stuff I haven't.So hows it going with your scorpio,good or bad?Have you talked to him or vice versa about the crush stuff?Don't worry 209 going off topic is normal with the chicks here.
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Storm
@Storm
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 152 · Topics: 8
Libragirl you said: "It seems about every scorpio i know has rarely accepted responsibility for their actions.

I think this is exactly the type of perspective that causes trouble. I am a scorpio it's true, however, I've been one who has always accepted responsibility for my actions. I'm not an egotist in any way shape or form, nor do I have a God complex. I'm the most imperfect person I know, the closest thing to perfection that I've seen in a person is a virgo friend of mine. And even he has troubles with things like the rest of us.

Then you said: "When it?s us ?mere? mortals, we certainly know about it, especially from you guys". And by mentioning "mere mortals", i am being very sarcastic.

If we were to just let things alone, and not say anything to someone that has done wrong by us, then we would never have any friendships/relationships at all. Rather than being hurt by anyone, we would avoid everybody. Which of course, doesn't help with the growing process. It could very well be that that's what is perceived on a general basis about scorpio. Which is mostlikely why this message board is in play so that all signs can have a good idea of what if any, is misunderstood.
Despite the stigma of my sign, I would like to further note that I'm not out to sacrifice other people's feelings for my own gain. I'm not one to step on another, to rise above, nor do I perceive everyone else as "mere mortals." I do however feel that others don't understand where I'm coming from all the time, and sometimes my emotions get in the way of my trying to convey what I need to in order for them to understand what's going on with me. The whole idea of life in general is for us to learn from eachother, if we don't, then we might as well stop breathing. I love to learn, and I love to help others, watching friends or family of mine succeed is the greatest thing in the world to me. I hope this helps...

Take care...
Storm
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lizard_scorpio
@lizard_scorpio
20 Years1,000+ PostsScorpio

Comments: 0 · Posts: 2180 · Topics: 8
hi everyone,

i'm new here.

read Scorpio209's posts and how you all reacted. want to participate in that much fun, too.

couldn't come up with a good user name, but when i read about the lizard side of scorpio... well, that would be me 😉 tataaaaaa..... lizard!!! slimy little rat, hehe!!!!

to storm: well put, i share you attitude towards "taking responsibility for ones actions" and about the rest!!! you seem to be a "quiet storm", nice!

to all non-scorpios: thanx for sticking around, probably not always easy.

to everybody: thanx for sharing your thoughts!!!!

if my english sounds odd to you guys, then maybe because i?m not a native english speaker. apologies in advance?. correction is very much appreciated!

your turn!
lizard



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patron
@patron
20 YearsScorpio

Comments: 0 · Posts: 90 · Topics: 4
To seizetheday(I do like your name did it came from the game magic:the gathering?)

Well to add some more information regarding the lizard, as I mentioned in my previous post those are more likely to be immature scorp's and correction, I did not mention anything about disliking them. The reason why the information regarding the lizard is kinda rare, is because of the fact that thier is only a few scorp's who became lizard. Well of course most of us scorp' do tend to become the eagle/rising phoenix as others call them, instead of the stinger/scorpio. Since it was our nature to compete and strive to became a better individual, although most of you(none scorp) may not observe this trait. However thier are still some who are not strong/determine enough has been loss and become of what is called the lizard.
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seizeTheDay
@seizeTheDay
20 Years1,000+ Posts

Comments: 0 · Posts: 2255 · Topics: 55
Hi Patron-

My name is extracted from a latin quote, Carpe diem quam minimum credula postero , which literally means, "pluck the day, never trust the next". In other words-- seize THIS day, because tomorrow is never promised.

It reminds me not to procrastinate, live in the moment and not hold on to grudges because essentially- life is too short. Also- I thought it perfectly represented typical arien (Aries) behavior!
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Scorpio209
@Scorpio209
20 Years

Comments: 0 · Posts: 8 · Topics: 2
Dear fellow scorp's and other's who get along with scorpios. Yea candlegirl...you were right...lol i was thinking weather i should retreat or reply, and yes i been reading every message all along, lol. anyhow, im way over that cancer saying whatever about scorpios and so on thing. Tell you the truth, in reality i care about cancers and pisces. i think we scorpios have a responsibilty to look out for our same water element type of people, because other people try to take an advantage of our sensitivity and being over emotional. but me, a scorpio that has the sun, pluto, saturn and mercury (the planet with the brains) all in scorpio will never let a person take an advantage of a fellow water sign or especially a Scorpio. Thats a given fact. Obviously i have to know the person a bit to know there sun sign, so therefore i will defend them. So thats the only reason why i got very upset when she had said such words, because we scorpios are one of the most patient but if crossed also the most dangerous. And i definetly want people to be aware of that. I'll never look for a fight or an argument, but if someone does do somthing bad to me, then that is my promise to strick back with a vengence. So again, i didnt mean to hurt poor cancers feelings, i look at cancer women as our sisters and pisces women, and always there to help a fellow scorpio especially, But do not in any way, challenge us. because that will make us prejudice in a way, and bring out our dark side. so lets keep it as family. Because in reality if you look at it. water signs are the only ones that understand eachother at a deep level, so i think we should be more close to eachother and unite, instead of fighting and arguing. theres soo much more i have to say, but there different subjects so i will open up a new topic. But as far as for this one.....u see we scorpios are not greedy people. all of us have an ability to become that eagle, even the lizard. i been a lizard almost all my life, then become a scorpion, and now rising from my ashes. All i want in life is a beautiful scorpio wife, with steady income. and i can live like the happiest person on this planet. I know some scorpios, that have this and are very happy, very good people. But when our emotional side is not ful-filled, then we tend to have uncontroled emotions and keep switching from an eagle to a lizard, a scorpio, a snake and so on. its very difficult, i change my personality almost everyday. but im trying to maintain my eagle resemblence. but i know once i get my scorpio queen...theres nothing more in the world i can ask for. money im not worried about. we are very ambitious and we can manage. dont have to be a billionare, but im not saying im satisfied with being poor. im saying that money is not a factor. thats how ambitious and confident i am. i can that out like nothing. its the scorpio women that must have immediately. and been thinking about this since i was about 9, seriously. and the scorpios that are denying this, are lying, lol, most likely. because if your a true scorpio, like I, then you must have been thinking about your dream wife as a kid. anyways, you guys and girls, stay motivated and remember, that lizard and scorpio will take you no where. believe me buddy. when i was a lizard, i was seeking death. someone to cause some type of trouble with me, and i can destroy them. Be like that high flying Eagle, thats high in the sky, but you mess with it, it will strike you so hard, that will teach you a lesson, and then fly away. So just unleash that scorpio side of you only when neccesary, otherewise maintain an eagle like.well anyways, take care everyone. hope to hear from you guys soon.

Scorpio209
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I have been involved with a scorpio for over 2 years. The first time he planted his eyes on me he said " I don't trust you" He has stuck to his word but then again, he has stuck around for 2 years. He has never said that I have lied to him nor has he
callmemsram
@callmemsram
20 YearsAries
Joined: Apr 09, 2005 · Topics: 11 · Posts: 178
Well...I told u guys before that I said some things to my scorpio friend because I was angry with him.....well I apologized and he is still ignoring me. Well when I realized he was ignoring me I started to email him on purpose with silly things to aggrava
softy
@softy
20 Years1,000+ Posts
Joined: Jan 18, 2005 · Topics: 79 · Posts: 1234
Ok so I have recently run into a dilemma. It's between a Scorpio and a Capricorn/Sagitarius

On one hand I have known the Scorpio for 3.5 years. We've been on and off for all those years. We had been fighting non-stop for months. I had enough and
Pisces03
@Pisces03
20 YearsPisces
Joined: Jan 27, 2005 · Topics: 3 · Posts: 64