Promised myself I wouldn't do this but...

Want to start by saying that I've held off on this for a while, I've been reading this board for just about a year and half now, and learned a lot. I finally joined a few months ago, always wondering whether or not to seek advice on this situation, as this is the one point of my life that I've tried to go it alone on. However, every passing day seems to bring more questions than answers. So with that said...

I'm a sag male, 21, born Dec. 5th. End of Feb. 2011 I met someone who for the better or worse has been about the most life-changing person I've ever met. She's a year older, Leo-Virgo cusp, and I mean she literally straddles the line, if I remember right she was born at 6 am, just 6 hours into Virgo. Funny what a difference 6 hours can make. She exhibits strong traits of both signs, she's definitely the most intense person I've ever met. We met and it was instant attraction. We met, and I had to leave out of town for a couple weeks, we talked the entire time. The moment we were able to see each other again, we spent the whole night talking and kissing, it was like I knew this girl my whole life, and at the same time she was so mysterious and interesting. I had never felt anything like this. Being a sag, I love everyone, in a sense, but never even really considered truly committing to any one girl. This one was far different. We moved quickly, slept together the third night we ever spent together, and from that point on it was pure heaven for both of us. It was hard for us to spend any length of time apart, although we also both (I thought) valued our space. Unfortunately, summer happened, and after an extremely painful goodbye (but no separation), we did our best to keep it going. I went to visit her once, and it was far and away the best weekend of my life. I loved her, her family, everything. Our sexual connection was...unreal. She's sharp, witty, extremely smart, and physically I've never met a more beautiful girl. However, 2 weeks after the visit, things began to slip. It was hard for us to talk much due to the timezone difference, work, and just the difference of our schedules. Skype never worked, we were reduced to texts and phone calls, which for us was pure hell. One night, I expressed my disappointment when she didn't want to talk and instead wanted to watch TV and go to bed. I over-reacted, we fought, and the rest of the weekend we only had a couple, long conversations that all ended less than well. 2nd part below

Ok. Second half. I'll try to keep this shorter. Progression the weekend she broke up with me seemed to be Friday: Upset, hurt by my reaction, but not breaking up don't worry. Saturday: Same feelings, not sure we should stay together. Sunday: Same feelings, wanted the break up. It was devastating. I'd be lying if I didn't say it was the most painful experience I've been through in my life, losing her. She had promised we'd try again in the fall, or at least talk about it. That never happened. When we got back, she avoided me, despite my best efforts to try to sit down and talk with her. Finally, one night, I found out she had a new relationship, and that killed me. She finally agreed to meet and talk, that didn't go well. She had basically convinced herself that a lot of things were true about me that weren't, and I couldn't convince her otherwise. She is definitely the most stubborn person I've ever met as well, part of the reason I loved her so much. I still see her around, and we are capable of being friendly, although one night she did start a fight, basically beating me over the head with my feelings for her. I guess my biggest question is...do Virgos (because she is primarily a Virgo) ever reconsider or even think of coming back? I could tell there were times she was thinking about it, although she didn't want me to think that. At one point, there was discussions about getting engaged at a certain point in time if we could last, and every single thing in both our lives seemed to be lining up. It was such an abrupt change, with still no real closure. I guess I just wonder what she was/is thinking, and if she's gotten over it, why does she still bring it up every other time she sees me? It's very strange, for sure.

Posted by JustaSag
She had basically convinced herself that a lot of things were true about me that weren't, and I couldn't convince her otherwise.


I still see her around, and we are capable of being friendly, although one night she did start a fight, basically beating me over the head with my feelings for her.

she's a virgo 😛 not a pretend leo. if she seems like a leo at times, check other aspects of her chart.

the above two statements, what did she convince herself of in regard to you?

your feelings for her? that you didn't have enough of them or the fact that you won't let go?

Haha very true. Although since we were together for less than a full year, and it started and ended after and before her birthday, I never had a chance to double-check. I'm embarrassed as hell to say, I actually remembered her birthday a day off, and for the longest time (when I still didn't know much about astrology) thought she was a leo, and she seemed to fit the description fine, apart from a couple things. I've looked at other aspects, can't remember off the top of my head now.

In terms of her thoughts about me, she never seemed to trust me. I've run into that in the past, despite never once doing anything untrustworthy in any relationship. She always seemed to give off the impression that she thought I was going to leave her as soon as I'd had my fill. Actually, for the first week we talked, it was all I could do just to convince her I wouldn't. I've been told I come off as a bit of a womanizer, and I guess I have been, although she never actually saw this side of me. Funny thing was, I had trouble suppressing the same thoughts about her. I think there was a lot of trust issues for the first few days, although I got over mine quickly. She never quite seemed to. I tend to have a lot of friends that are girls, although I put them all out of my life the moment I met her. I actually ended a relationship of sorts the day I met her just so I could dedicate myself to trying to be with her. Regardless, she always seemed bothered by this. She was definitely was less than thrilled by the fact that I'm good with meeting people. I never once flirted with a girl after meeting her, although she seemed to think I would given the chance. Other than that, she seemed annoyed by the fact that I never got mad at her (strange) and almost became more upset if she became frustrated with me and I didn't get mad back at her. I always let it roll off my back, this seemed to confuse and infuriate her, why I don't know.

As far as the feelings, she seems to every month or so accuse me of not getting over her, although I've (pretty convincingly I thought) told her to her face that I have. When I do that, she starts to almost yell at me for having ever loved her, and how could I love someone like her, she's not that great, she's a terrible person, etc. It's almost hard to watch. She's done this a few times since the breakup, unsolicited. It's very confusing. Not sure why she feels the need to keep doing it. I never seek her out, as much as I want to.

well give her what she's asking for...a good hard slap. tell her she's ugly, fat and that you fucked her sister, but only after fucking her mother and when you leave, kick her dog 😛

she sounds immature and you equally immature for finding her endearing.

I'm not sure immature is the word, she is incredibly responsible, she might have the best balance of crazy and restrained of any person I know. She's the only person I know that managed to keep me in line, and she definitely made me better myself while I was with her. Rationally, and in terms of dealing with other people, she is definitely one of the more mature people I know. However, emotionally, she is very insecure, and I could tell not long after I met her. I didn't really care, it was fine between us before it ended. I knew if it ever ended it would be messy, but for 95% of the time we were together there was no problem. She has a big problem, I think, with separation, and she's been cheated on before a couple times, so I know it's not all immaturity. There's a little bit of self-defense in there. She is definitely one of the most self-reliant people I know as well, she certainly doesn't "need" anybody. I think she got scared. But I'll never know because she never really wanted to fully open up to me about her decision to leave me, definitely goes against the Virgo in her. She's very extroverted, but only about things she wants to be. She's had a very complex life, and even with all the hundreds of hours we spent talking about our own secrets, I know I never learned it all. She definitely has growing to do, but don't we all? I guess I just want to know if that's likely to happen, and if her stubbornness will continue indefinitely. I'll have to find more of her chart.

Even if she did change her mind, should it matter? If more people were accommodating like you, then everyone would be taking breaks at their convenience to test drive new relationships. It's pretty hard to get a fully invested Virgo to break off a relationship, even if you're trying. You sound fairly committed. She most certainly isn't.

It's probably too idealistic of me to think so, but I still do. The fact is, I've never even come close to having a connection like that with another human being, and she said the same thing when she was with me. I guess that's more what I was getting at...she was the one that pushed the relationship every step of the way after all. The only time I pushed it along was to make the initial effort to start talking to her, and I told her that I loved her first, although she reciprocated. So I guess I never thought of her (at the time) as lacking in commitment. Although I do realize they don't just leave. It was such a sharp contrast, one day she was blissfuly in love, then the next, after one fight (which she did cite as the reason it happened), she lost it. I'm just trying to figure out if that fits the typical Virgo pattern, as I never really was close to one ever before.

Posted by piscesmoon
My father is a Virgo... the birthday really did you no favors... she may have even seemly did not care but believe me she did... I think she may have not wanted to invest her feelings because she was not around you enough to know you where not up to no good... She got together with most likely a "safe guy" that she thinks would never do something... She most likely regrets it because she would not be throwing it in you face... even more so in front of people... I don't think she will want to be with you if she is not around you... some people are like that... out of sight out of mind... Maybe she started to like the new guy and lost interest in you because he was their and she was needy... Her insecurities got the best of her... Unless gossip some how got to her...

I don't know what you should really do...

You could tell her yes I still had a thing for you a bit after yes it sucked... yes maybe I not over all the way... but I know if you can't trust me and have a new bf you can't be my girlfriend... Not only that with you throwing that in my face I think i am getting over it quick...

If you want you could also tell her look you know how I felt... and if you want to tell me something new then do it not I am not waiting for you... I am just not jumping into a relationship...

I know it is hard but... I don't think she is ready for a relationship... Girls always think they are but if they are too young and everyone has a different maturate date... Then you have to try to be real with yourself and not get overly emotionally invested unless you can trust them to that point... That point should be almost marrying... I know you thought about it but be realistic even then you know you where not ready... look at now...

I can say if she is like my dad... I don't know how faithful she will be... and normally if my step mother thinks something is up... it is always her... not him... She keeps pointing the finger at you... not cool

Be around happy people... if you need to don't be around her anymore... may help you get over her...

PM

You seem to pretty much hit it on the head, you actually really described it perfectly. She told me several times that she wasn't sure we would last with a prolonged long distance between us, and this made her very upset when we were together, to the point of tears. I'll never forget that one we

That's weird it got cut off, I'm still not used to this site haha. The rest: I'll never forget that one weekend she had to be away for a couple days, and even only about 6-7 hours after she left, she was already extremely depressed and sad about not being with me. She told me that she was always like this, and this episode was one of the reasons that she was scared for a 3 month separation. You definitely seem to think the same way I do about her behavior now, the last time this happened we ran into each other at a bar, and actually spent about an hour together, had a great time. She offered me a ride home, and we were talking about typical things, law school, career, family, just catching up. All of a sudden, she just started to ask me if I was over her, and her temper escalated to the point where by the time she pulled up to my place to drop me off, she was so upset that people inside the house could hear her, needless to say I was quite embarrassed and I felt totally helpless, the whole time I was simply trying to defend myself. That's basically indicative of how's she's acted since the breakup. And I always suspected it was as you said, but she won't admit it. About a year ago we had a sit down that was about 3 hours long, I was fairly harsh with her, but she really had no responses for my questions, her face looked guilty however, which I had never seen before. So doing that again isn't really something I want to do at the moment. Perhaps when I'm ready to get out of here in another 7-8 months, when I know I might never see her again, I might try. For now I'm just trying to understand things. Being around her isn't necessary, although she goes to law school here now so occasional run-ins are unavoidable. The idea of choosing someone safe, that seems to be a typical earth-sign thing, I've been bitten by it several times. Is that a Virgo trait as well? It's very frustrating, I can't tell you how many relationships have been ruined by this. This time it actually mattered, so it's especially painful. Are Virgos really that distrustful?

dude, she's a bi-polar, wackado!

on top of that, she's a young virgo, so she's TRULY psychotic. that fit of rage you experienced, she needs 4-5 more years before she even begins to wrangle that shit in.

you also stated that she gets upset with you because "you still want her" when in reality, her crazed ass still wants you.

i know that you have feelings for this chick and for the life of me i can't figure out why, but seriously, move the fuck on. what you're interpreting as leo fire is actually virgo psychosis.

JustaSag,

She is insecure and blaming you for feeling that way. She sabotaged the relationship with you to support her belief about herself, that she's unworthy. You have more self-esteem than she does. So it won't work between the two of you because it is a mismatch. It doesn't matter if the chemistry, attraction, and everything else is great. Every piece is vital to sustain the puzzle, and this is one piece that is missing: trust.

Moving on to another guy was just her way of escaping from dealing with her problems. It won't work out with that guy either.

Do you enjoy the accusations? Because this is what the relationship will continue to be like if you are still with her. The honeymoon phase where everything was so wonderful is over. Reality is this. Do you like what you see? You can't change it. Lots of beautiful people can create hell for us. You want beautiful and healthy, not just beautiful.

Chalk this up as a tough first lesson in what to look for in a woman. Red flags are there for a reason. Her red flag is accusing you falsely and not feeling worthy of you.

"The fact is, I've never even come close to having a connection like that with another human being."

You're 21. It makes perfect sense you never experienced this before. Live another decade and you'll see this can happen often. She isn't the first and won't be the last. Let her go. She is damaged and needs to fix herself before she can be yours.

Virgospirit,

I kind of figured that would be the ultimate opinion. I just wanted to hear from other Virgos to see if I was right. I have a pretty good idea of what I find attractive in a woman, the problem is that I will never be attracted to someone who isn't difficult. I like strong-personality, mature, assertive, alpha-females, I like someone that can keep up with me physically and mentally, someone that can conduct themselves just right in every situation, and also who pushes themselves and is independent. I was slowly coming to that realization when I met her, it's kind of a case where meeting her showed me what I wanted, unfortunately someone like that is not necessarily good relationship material. I don't of course enjoy the poor temper or the criticism. But I can deal with it. I've been through much worse in my life, so it really didn't bother me. It's something that bothers her, I know it did and she realized it. She wasn't always able to control it.

I guess what really makes me the saddest is that while we were together I could see the insecurity leave, and it was beautiful. I think she learned to be like that, she wasn't born like that. She has a great family, and great friends (many of whom are still my friends as well) but I think her natural Virgo tendencies combined with some of the people she's dated have made her like this, not an excuse but a reason. I really did think that she would grow out of it, it really was unfortunate timing for the separation. I know I know I'm young...always valid. Although I've been with many girls, from a night to a couple months, none of them really meant much to me other than as friends. The fact that I am even talking about her means a something to me. I know she can be better, I've seen it. It's just too bad she won't give herself the chance again.

None of the qualities that you described are actually "difficult". The problem is that a lot of people seem to be making flashy outward displays of assertiveness and drive in order to compensate for their inward feelings of insecurity. This isn't a sign-specific trait.

It is possible to be simultaneously well-grounded, playful, and passionate about what you do. Such people's actions tend to speak for themselves (and the ones that I've encountered seem to inevitably turn out to be Taureans, for some infuriating reason T_T). It takes considerably more character to handle a relationship with someone who doesn't have the insecurities that you described, as you're not going to get an ego boost out of saving them or enduring their neuroticisms - they're genuinely your equal (let's face it, it's easy to get addicted to playing the hero for less well-adjusted people).

If anything, you at least now know what you're capable of giving another person, if you didn't before. That's not a quality of the relationship. That's your own quality.

She's bipolar so calling her psycho by the psychos of DXP is just too perfect. I'm self-diagnosed mildly bipolar as well, although she seems to be more extreme - give her a break as it sounds like she doesn't even know it herself. Sag/Virgo never really works anyway, differences are good but these signs are just way too different.

Posted by Lochinvar
None of the qualities that you described are actually "difficult". The problem is that a lot of people seem to be making flashy outward displays of assertiveness and drive in order to compensate for their inward feelings of insecurity. This isn't a sign-specific trait.

It is possible to be simultaneously well-grounded, playful, and passionate about what you do. Such people's actions tend to speak for themselves (and the ones that I've encountered seem to inevitably turn out to be Taureans, for some infuriating reason T_T). It takes considerably more character to handle a relationship with someone who doesn't have the insecurities that you described, as you're not going to get an ego boost out of saving them or enduring their neuroticisms - they're genuinely your equal (let's face it, it's easy to get addicted to playing the hero for less well-adjusted people).

If anything, you at least now know what you're capable of giving another person, if you didn't before. That's not a quality of the relationship. That's your own quality.

I get what you're saying, and it's not that I derive any particular pleasure from being the hero; I like to help people get better but I certainly don't look for relationships to do this. In fact, I hate to be in relationships where I perceive that the other person has nothing to add, I don't necessarily like only being looked up to, I prefer to do that. She's one of only a few people in my life I could feel like that with to this point, so that's interesting.

Funny you say that about Taurus, I've had my fill of them for 5 lifetimes. Virgos seem much less insane to me, in terms of using actual logic to make decisions.

She actually was diagnosed with something a while back, can't remember what as she didn't want to talk about it, which I can understand. What can I say, I love crazy people. They're usually smarter and more interesting 😉 But in all honesty, that's usually how it is for me.