Satan & Freedom of Religion

Didn't want to derail the other thread. I'm curious to see where the discussion would go. Your thoughts?
http://www.latimes.com/local/abcarian/la-me-ra-why-christians-should-embrace-the-satan-statue-in-oklahoma-20140107,0,7147783.story#axzz2qf2g9Lz0

—The statue will also have a functional purpose as a chair, where people of all ages may sit on the lap of Satan for inspiration and contemplation,?? said Lucien Greaves, a co-founder of the Satanic Temple, which is behind the unusual proposal."

http://www.dxpnet.comhttp://www.trbimg.com/img-52ccd21e/turbine/la-me-ra-why-christians-should-embrace-the-sat-001/600

Will the ACLU give these folks support? I wonder...

I don't want to see those kids there. They can build the statue without. Looks like a Capricorn IMO

Posted by LetltB
—The statue will also have a functional purpose as a chair, where people of all ages may sit on the lap of Satan for inspiration and contemplation

This sounds funny as hell. Satan was Santa Claus all along.

"All stuff-of-nightmares aside, the Satanists make an important point."

—By accepting our offer, the good people of Oklahoma City will have the opportunity to show that they espouse the basic freedoms spelled out in the Constitution. We imagine that the ACLU will also embrace such a response. Allowing us to donate a monument would show that the Oklahoma City Council does not discriminate and both the religious and the non-religious should be happy with such an outcome. Our mission is to bring people together by finding common sentiments that create solutions that everyone can appreciate and enjoy.??

—Our position is we??d like to see the government get out of the religious monument business altogether,?? said ACLU of Oklahoma Legal Director Brady Henderson. —Our feeling is, more religious display doesn't solve the fundamental problem that the government is wading into the religious realm.??

Not that he thinks the Satanic Temple is completely off base.

Posted by Damnata
I don't want to see those kids there. They can build the statue without. Looks like a Capricorn IMO

...lol on a first date 😄

I just noticed how he's standing with his hooves crossed. Fancy.

The kids don't seem to be too thrilled about him.

Posted by Damnata
I just noticed how he's standing with his hooves crossed. Fancy.

The kids don't seem to be too thrilled about him.

..do you see the impression formed between his knees? May just be coincidental..

Nope, it even has a shadow that doubles as a beard.

Posted by feby16aqua
Check who whispers in your ear...

Don't know what to say about that.

Posted by feby16aqua
"It doesn't matter if you are doing good in the name of Satan or the name of Jesus Christ, as long as you are doing good."

I actually agree with this. You can be a moral person and do a lot of good, Satanist, Christian or Atheist.

The thought of the Crusades come to mind.

Posted by feby16aqua
propaganda at it's finest. Lies to conceal the truth. That's the way that satan works. Check who whispers in your ear...

+1 I'm waiting to see (if it happens) the fight they are going to give the ACLU. Could be quite interesting, not only that what politicians/people support them. Talk about exposure and weeding people out eh?

Posted by PVAF
They have the right to want thud statue. But I think it should be up to the people of Oklahoma whether it goes up.

I'm a firm believer in separation of church and state. I don't think any religious statues or monuments should be up at any government facilities. Including the Ten Commandments monument they were speaking of in Oklahoma.

I wouldn't add any new monuments. It has nothing to do with it bring a Satanic monument, it's just principle for me.

It's actually not up to the people of Oklahoma unfortunately. My head has been spinning since the religious visitors showed up at my house yesterday and told me about this. I am a firm believer there are those in power who hide behind Jesus that are just as evil as the devil himself. Now they can proudly show us who they are...(maybe).😢

I agree with Damnata,lose the kids, and the design could be way better, although I think Danzig would approve...
His (Greaves) dual function argument gave me a good laugh though. I can just see telling my 6 year old, "One more time or we're going to the chair...your choice.". It would seem that the ACLU has already made their stance quite clear. Other than that...why not build a statue?

He really looks harmless though. Like a Capricorn on an interview.

Posted by PVAF

Well that's a shame. 😢 I'm with ACLU. No religious statue is proper on the grounds of a government institution. This country is not a theocracy.

And if we gonna start putting religious monuments up, them the satanists have a point. Why shouldn't they be allowed fair representation?

I'm all about civil liberties. Remember this?

""The monument's placement at the Capitol has created a more divisive and hostile state for many Oklahomans," said Ryan Kiesel, ACLU of Oklahoma's executive director. "When the government literally puts one faith on a pedestal, it sends a strong message to Oklahomans of other faiths that they are less than equal."

The lawsuit, filed in Oklahoma County District Court, seeks to have the religious monument removed, citing the constitutional prohibition on using state property to support particular religions or sects.

"On fundamental matters of faith, the state has no business telling its citizens what to believe," said Daniel Mach, director of the national ACLU's Program on Freedom of Religion and Belief. "No one should be made to feel unwelcome at their own state Capitol."

IMO..this issue is a much needed slap in the face to all government entities who use political power and force on it's people. It will be interesting to see their response to all of this. Damn hypocrites. Solution: REMOVE THE 10 COMMANDMENTS MONUMENT. ..but will they?

Can we please just leagalize gay marriage first then get to the bloody statue??_.all good things in time

Take down all statues or build all statues.

Posted by Rabbit
I'm not religious, so this statue means squat to me.

But I can see how it could be offensive to anyone of an Abrahamic faith. They're treading a fine line between expressing religious freedom and just instigating.

That being said, you can't offend anyone if you display NOTHING.

I don't give a rats ass either. It definitely is a matter of instigating however I look at who instigated and manipulated by opening the door to this first.

Posted by Damnata
Take down all statues or build all statues.

Cheapest route..attitude should be POINT TAKEN and remove the 10 commandments, put it in front of a church. Simple.

Ugh... I am definitely feeling torn on this one. The side of me that wants freedom for everyone equally says shrug and let it happen. The side of me that grew up in a church wants to get out the holy water.

I guess I have to side with Damnata here. :/

Posted by Damnata
Take down all statues or build all statues.

Posted by The_eleventh_sign_11
Can we please just leagalize gay marriage first then get to the bloody statue??_.all good things in time

It's legal over here 😉

They want to inspire people with that?

What happened to statues of Mother Teresa or Nelson Mandela or Lassie, for that matter. LOL

Posted by djbuck1
Isn't Satanism a religion?

I think so??_ that's where all the pedophiles gather.

Buddhism is centered around introspection and humanity

Anytime topics like this come up ... I have to chuckle at the thought that if this 300/400 years ago, we'd all be burnt at the stake for even entertaining such thoughts.

As for the statute ... I'm double-sided about how I feel about it.

1. people should be allowed their right to religion, so any/all statutes should be allowed to be erected.

...... yet ......

2. if the motive here is to be indignant against Christianity, or to be in spite of it ... then the statute shouldn't be allowed to go up

Posted by aquapiscescusp

Posted by The_eleventh_sign_11
Can we please just leagalize gay marriage first then get to the bloody statue??_.all good things in time

It's legal over here 😉

click to expand

Oh well by all means erect that big hard statue up!??_

lets see how long it would last against angry villagers

Posted by Lucciferi
Go do your research on satanism. It's not what you think it is (a cult in the woods killing babies to please the Almighty Satan).

^^^That would be a derailment and an instigative spin of what this thread is about. Doesn't have ANYTHING to do with who believes in what or people who hate others for what they believe in. Go back and read from the beginning. Thanks

Posted by seraph
Religious icons belong in front of churches/places of worship, and not in front of government buildings.

Though if a democracy walks around wearing a theocratic coat, the situation can get a little sticky. Add to that a very vocal and politically well-financed movement (now entrenched) in the US that has every expectation that this troublesome mixture of theocratic-secular functioning continue, and you've got a problem that's bigger than it really needs to be. And yes, as was mentioned earlier, it's occurring at the expense of *real* issues that need resolution, such as gay marriage. Though one need not preclude the other, I'd be more concerned about people than statues.

That being said, seeing a few statues of the Buddha in these places *instead*, would be a refreshing change indeed. 😉

No homophobic antics please. Buddhism ok..however saying "*instead*" meaning in place of not so much. Freedom of religion applies to all in this country.

Posted by djbuck1
I think that the Satanists are arguing that yes, Satanism is a religion, and that if the Ten Commandments are allowed to be set up in a public space, then they should have a chance to erect their own . . . manifestation?

This would make more sense to me if what they were setting up was a scroll of some kind of Satanic verse as opposed to a representation of their . . . deity?

Including the children in a blatant jab at the Christ's "suffer the little children to come unto me," is really over-the-top in my opinion. Truly distasteful.

Agreed.

"And so they came up with the idea for a statue of "Baphomet," a cheeky... response to the Ten Commandments monument erected on the Capitol grounds in 2012 by legislators who tried to push the idea that prescriptions are secular, not religious. "

I remember another news story where religious folks donated a statue and the public outcry was loud--

It may be referencing the same statue of the Ten-- idk, but iirc, the response was that it wasn't taxpayer funded, and anyone else was more than welcome to do the same.

Although, as you said, they would probably have better results if they offered a monument that reflected their sentiments --

" ... rejection of arbitrary authority and respect for personal sovereignty."

-- without the grotesque imagery that has historically been representative of chaos; the antithesis of civilization.

I'm scared. That thing looks creepy as fuck and those kids look even creepier. Look at their hands.

lmao @ anybody believing satanism can be used for good

thats an upside down pentagram meaning the Satanism you are trying to convey is the Evilism and not actual satanism.

This is why Evil has it ways in many things and people know not of what is true or what is Evil.

Any religion that has an upside down pentagram displayed in its there abouts, is plain and simple, EVIL

EVIL=DIE

Posted by seraph

Supporting gay marriage and speaking well of it isn't "homophobic."

We might do infinitely better with something a little less socially divisive. But this is irrespective of the actual freedom to believe and practice. You can do what you like, even if it's monumentally stupid.

Last time I checked, gay marriage isn't a religion. Not in the states anyway.

Also, Duck Dynasty called gay marriage stupid. You jumped on that shit wagon and did a dance. Now look at you. Hypocrite.

Dead issue Seraph

You've exposed yourself as a hypocrite time and time again.

Give it a rest fella.