Ladies, You Need To Be Honest...

Consider this post a vent on my end. I have some really great, cool female friends. Downside is hearing about their complaints in the dating scene.

A lot of my female friends will go "I had this really cute guy approach me. He was cool and funny, but since I didnt know him didnt feel like giving my number/email/facebook out" "So I made up a lie and said that I had a boyfriend or I was lesbian."

Oftentimes out of curiosity I ask "Do you prefer meeting guys in social circles/mutual friends?" Its been a uniamous "Yes" every time.

After that, I dont say anything. Cause I dont want my opinion to piss someone off and make me a social pariah in our circle of friends. But since Im among strangers, I'll say it here.

If meeting guys through friends is your preference, why dont you tell the nonpotential suiter? Most men I know respect honesty even if its painful. To give credit, there are some gals who are straight up painfully honest. But most of the time, women seem to be extremely passive-aggressive in communicating. A guy will respect you much more by just being honest.

Having grown up and being friends with women all my life, I've gotten a pretty good insight into a girl's mindset. I meet women through mutual friends since learning of their preference. I dont approach a girl unless she is being straight up about liking me. Or they approach me.

I prefer women who are aggressive when it comes to dating. That's probably why I've gone out with so many fire or air signs. Or girls who have those as moon signs in their chart. But's that my modus operandi.

Seriously you're going to be doing all of your guy friends a favor doing this so we dont have to hear you piss and moan about it. Though I find it interesting that women change their way of thinking on this mindset if a guy is either : athlete, musician, actor, rich, etc. 😉

Posted by ZenArcade
Consider this post a vent on my end. I have some really great, cool female friends. Downside is hearing about their complaints in the dating scene.

Having grown up and being friends with women all my life, I've gotten a pretty good insight into a girl's mindset. I meet women through mutual friends since learning of their preference. I dont approach a girl unless she is being straight up about liking me. Or they approach me.

Seriously you're going to be doing all of your guy friends a favor doing this so we dont have to hear you piss and moan about it. Though I find it interesting that women change their way of thinking on this mindset if a guy is either : athlete, musician, actor, rich, etc. 😉

They seem like a pretty shallow group of girlfriends from what you have told us. Ever think of upgrading?

As one of the painfully honest, I have to say that Woody Allen is not my type. And even when you tell me he is a rich actor, he will never be my type.

There is chemistry or there isn't. If your friends are faking chemistry in order to marry people because they perceive it as a cool thing to do then they are existing in a little world of sadness.

Do any of yore mail freinds go out with chikcs whose bust size is biggar than thier IQ?

Posted by ZenArcade
Consider this post a vent on my end. I have some really great, cool female friends. Downside is hearing about their complaints in the dating scene.

A lot of my female friends will go "I had this really cute guy approach me. He was cool and funny, but since I didnt know him didnt feel like giving my number/email/facebook out" "So I made up a lie and said that I had a boyfriend or I was lesbian."

LMAO this is what my Aries friend does. Should a guy approach me and she can see I'm uncomfortable, she'll come up and say we're together xD in her defense she's not lying as she's bisexual. I guess she's only half lying =P


On my own, I just ignore them completely, like they're not even speaking to me. The passive approach never fails😉

As a woman with lots of air and fire in her chart......I apologize for the painfully honest types. Not all of us are as such 😉

Have you ever tried going out WITHOUT thinking/wondering if you will meet someone? From my experiences, this works well. I have met LOTS of people and made many friends without wondering what will come of it.

Enough with the dating politics!

A man will be considered a stranger to me whether I meet him through a mutual friend or not. Either way, I'd still have to go through the motions of getting to know him & giving him a fair chance

If a woman likes a man's swagger, likes his approach & what's coming out of his mouth, I think it's silly for a woman to turn him away all b/c he may not know someone she already knows.

I do agree though that women should tell men the truth up front...not give out fake #s or lead him on.

It's not that I'd have a problem dating a man who was famous. It's the life style that I'm entitled to not wanna put up with

lol @ swagger...... classic!

Really Aries Person - Actually, a lot of my guy friends go out with women that have high IQ's. Most of them date hipster/bohemian types.

And, some of my girl friends arent the hot type, they're cute girl next doorish. I never said they did date people for status. Although I did find it rather amusing that one girl who would "never" approach a guy did so when Owen Wilson was at a club.

Ellesque - a few of these girls share the same friends I do who work in the Music/nightclub industry. Therefore, if I say something to piss one of them off, its potential excommunication from the others when out and about.

Icered- Good on you for being real. I'd much rather a girl show strong signs of disinterest. Vs wasting my time by being nice and not wanting to be a bitch.

Archimedes- Who said that I was going out with the intention of meeting women? What I said was if I happen to meet a girl through mutual friends and she shows actual, no ambiguity interest, then there is pursuit. Im not looking to meet anyone at the moment. Im working long hours trying to keep a roof over my head. Which leaves little time for a relationship. The most I could do right now is be a F buddy with someone. If that kind of opportunity comes up, great. If not, there's always some good lesbian porn online. I think you misunderstood me on the painfully honest part. I'd RATHER a gal be painfully honest than be ambigious and lead me on.

That happened to me back in high school. I had a major crush on this cute, book wormish girl. We had some classes together. I talked to her once in a while in class and in the hallways. I was too shy to make a move till senior year. I went to prom with my friends. Got up the nerve to ask her to dance with me. We danced and had a good time. Talked for a few minutes then her friends came to pick her up.

The last month of senior year was really busy. So didnt see her. Then the night of graduation, there was an afterparty at school. I went with my friend. I bumped into her. We talked for a few minutes. During our conversation I brought up going to Lilith Fair to see Beth Orton. (Yes, this was back in the day of 1998) Asked if she was going to see Lilith as well.

Next time I know she yells loud enough where everyone can hear "Zen, Im not INTERESTED!" I was so embarassed. I left the party immediately thereafter. Slept for two days straight. It would be almost another year before I

Started trying again with women. Thankfully my dating life got much better after. On a up note, years later, I found her on FB. And she had ballooned to being 100 ibs over weight. I laughed my ass off. And was thankful I never ended up with her and that sometimes karma can come back around.

In conclusion did I mind her being honest? Not at all. But she didnt have to do it in such an embarassing and b---y manner. But if worst came to worst, I rather a girl be a b----h about saying she's not interested than acting like she is.

Perhaps I did misunderstand, to me it sounded like you had intentions of meeting women, hence my suggestion.

I agree with you though on women being more honest. I do have a question though, are you talking about women being honest in the sense that they are not interested ROMANTICALLY or not interested in you as a PERSON? There is a difference.

@Archimedes - It can be both. If a woman is not interested in me as a person Id rather them tell me to f-off.

Im just not into false airs. I think its a waste of theirs and my time.

The point of this whole thread is asking more women to show some backbone in romantic/social situations. Again, I realize there are some who do that. But as not as many as there really needs to be.

@Ever - I know its immature of me to have that reaction. But I couldnt help myself. I had a very personal tragic situation during the last two years of high school. Which Im confident she was aware of. And she could have handled the situation much better than she did.

But at least she was honest. So Ill give her props on that.

When I was single and strangers came up to me asking for my number it was a waste of my time to say I didn't want to get involved because I don't know them. This just leads to debating on his part and extending a conversation I don't want to have. Also, I think it takes guts to approach someone. Some of these guys that have come up to me were cute and seemed nice but I wasn't in a position to meet anyone even though I was single and I didn't want them to feel rejected. Maybe it would deter them from approaching someone who would be available to them. "I have a boyfriend" is short and sweet - no one feels rejected and I could quickly go about my business.

@Purrhiss - I wish more women would do that.

@Virgo - Just asking this out of curiosity. What makes you think saying "I have a boyfriend" isnt going to deter someone in the future? I know plenty of guys who will stick around through that.

Cause in their experience and even a couple of times in mine, it doesnt mean anything in some circumstances. Except that they're not looking for a replacement and only some sex on the side.

Ive seen a lot of my guy friends have sex with taken women who threw the boyfriend excuse out there. Now of course, not all taken women do that. But enough to where guys wont tell the difference and still think they have a chance of sealing the deal.

If it works for you great though. But a simple "F-off Im not attracted to you" would probably suffice with the aggressive types.

Seriously, that would be awesome if there was a freaky friday thing and some girls were guys for a day. And then try to approach women themselves. Seeing what men go through doing that. Only bi-sexual women do. But they have the advantage of being a woman so other girls will be instantly comfortable with them approaching.

That's why Im not looking actively right now. Aside from having a work schedule that probably is not compatible with other girls. Unless a girl is aggressive and shows unashamed directness, they're not worth what little I have of my time.

Yeah, I love my leo sun for this. I'm not aggressive but you will always know where you stand with me from the start. If I just met you, and I already get bad vibes, i'll just not engage with you. If I have to for some reason I will be polite but aloof.

When i'm into someone, they will verbally hear about it. I'm too straight-forward. However, I take my time with people. Yeah, I gotta get to know you. I don't date anyone who isn't my friend first. Any expectations at all from me in the very beginning and i'm gone!

True. Women do need to be more up front.

1 of my co-workers always complains about how the guys she's not interested in keep calling her. I'm like uhhh well why do you keep giving them your phone number??! Some guys are stalkers, but for the most part, it's clear that if she was really telling these guys the truth, they wouldn't still be chasing her.

She gets so out of shape about men liking her more than she likes them but maybe she wouldn't have that problem had she kept it real with them

I think ladies telling a guy her intentions up front is important too

For example...telling a guy that she is ok with being friends 1st but hopes things progress to a relationship is a good idea b/c if the guy is a committment phobe, he'll give that hint away early on vs. the girl finding out later all b/c she was too afraid to speak her mind

You've gotta ask folks what their intentions are & also tell them what their intentions are

@Zen "I have a bf" Works best with a complete stranger it might not stop a guy I am in constant contact with or someone at a club but on the street or in a store it usually does the trick. Sure there are some girls that might say no initially and use a fake excuse and change their minds but that could be for many reasons. In the past when I was a teen sometimes I would just get nervous by a guy I found attractive and the first thing out of my mouth would be something to make him go away when he came up to me - just out of my reflexes. Some girls do it because playing hard to get will get them attention that they enjoy. Others because they think the guy sees something in her based on all the efforts he's putting in to chase her.

Also bring on the freaky friday!!
See how you feel when men are saying yucky things to you for just walking down the street (and I don't even mean when you are dressed for a club, I'm talking t-shirt and jeans). Have you ever been followed home by a creepy stranger who was attracted to you and didn't care that you were not interested? It's happened to both my sister and myself. Sometimes some of the guys that hit on me are scary lol. I'd rather save F-off if all else fails and stick with I'm taken. After repeatedly debating with men you've politely said no to, you will probably bypass BF and claim you have a 300 lbs wrestler husband named Ivan who is waiting around the corner with a sledgehammer. You might think you will like being pursued by the opposite sex and sometimes it is nice if the guy is respectful but sometimes it will make you feel like a piece of meat.

@Virgo - Again, if that works for you, then rock on.


"In the past when I was a teen sometimes I would just get nervous by a guy I found attractive and the first thing out of my mouth would be something to make him go away when he came up to me - just out of my reflexes. Some girls do it because playing hard to get will get them attention that they enjoy. Others because they think the guy sees something in her based on all the efforts he's putting in to chase her."

Dont take this the wrong way or personal Virgo, but its stuff like this that stops a lot of guys from approaching women. Mixed signals is my pet peeve when it comes to women in the dating scene. Example, I talked to this girl at a party. I only approached cause it seemed like she was interested in me. I was nervous, maybe not making the most stimulating conversation but still trying the best I can.

About five minutes into it, she appeared bored and started looking elsewhere. I picked up on it and tried to be more entertaining with the convo. Two minutes later, seemed to not make an effect. So I took a hint and excused myself. Flash forward to an hour later. I run into a girl that Im friends with who is also pals with the girl I talked to.

She said " "Jennifer" was wondering why you walked away from her. She really, really liked you. I instantly face palmed myself and said "Gimme a break" Just a note ladies, when you looked bored, like you want the conversation to end, it actually will. Some guys may like a challenge, but most guys(sober anyway) will take that as their exit point.

Something women never seem to learn about men is we don't specialize in subtlety. We are not women and wont pick on subtleties. Women make it hard for themselves in today's dating scene period.

As far as Freaky Friday goes I dont need it to know what women go through when men approach them. Im approached by gay men consistantly. So take me being straight nicely. Others not so per example "You're straight? I can get you straight into bed" After that I gave him a stern and loud f-off. Worked for me.

Bottom line is it kind of annoying? Yes, especially when it makes me wish more women would be aggressive and approach like men do without the need of liquid courage or social status. Bottom line, I get on with my day. Its apart of life. I get women are more vulnerable and prone to attacks coupled with rape.

Its a very tragic, sad fact of the world we live in.

Either you can stay scared or do something about it. Take self-defense classes in depth or carry some type of weapon. If I were a dad when my daughters hit 10-11 years old, they would be taking self-defense classes.

And carry something to protect themselves.

But all of us can be attacked at any time. It depends on how we take the offense to it is all.

Women shouldnt complain about the guys they are attracted to not approaching them. When those guys probably heard from their females complaining about guys approaching them. Words have consequences.

No offense taken. Everyone is different and has their own way of doing things.

Ellesque - Something I was trying to convey in my response didnt come across that's my fault. Let me explain it better. Say I start dating a girl after telling my female friends the truth and eventual fall out occurs.

Let's say then I take her out downtown somewhere. People who work in the bar or restaurant are being icy to me. She'll pick up on that. It will be a huge red flag as first impressions are everything when dating. So even if Im being unjustly scarlet lettered, she wont see the other side of the story. I dont want to have to take a girl to the whole other side of town and have her wonder why.

Also, most Men and Women when it comes to friendships want sychophants/yes-men. They dont want someone to call them out when they are wrong on something. I know I appreciate friends who can tell me Im full of it. But Im a part of a minority in that regard.

I lost my best friend years ago, when I gave him unsolicited advice regarding his girl being a bad apple. They broke up precisely because she was a less than loyal girlfriend. Was I right in the end? Yes, but I was not right in telling him that. Unfortunately as much as we want to protect our friends from hurt, we have to let them land on their faces. Otherwise we end up paying for it by butting in.

So I cant tell them my true opinions. But at least in here I have a forum to do so. And let other women know guys dont like that kind of game.

@Everevol - Yes there are a lot of sleazy guys out there. Ive almost gotten into fights with several drunk guys on the bus cause they couldnt take a hint the girls werent interested.

There are some aggressive gals out there when it comes to dating single guys. But I wish there was more of them cause dating would be a lot easier

Posted by ZenArcade
Really Aries Person - Actually, a lot of my guy friends go out with women that have high IQ's. Most of them date hipster/bohemian types.

And, some of my girl friends arent the hot type, they're cute girl next doorish. I never said they did date people for status. Although I did find it rather amusing that one girl who would "never" approach a guy did so when Owen Wilson was at a club.

Owen Wilson huh? Perhaps she was drunk and perhaps she just has bad taste. I have never met Owen, but he sure seems like a goose whenever I have seen him interviewed.

I too have made the "you simply cannot marry this chick" speech to a couple of people.
They are both still my friends - I guess they realise I would only say stuff like that if I was deadly serious.
One didn't marry the girl, much to everyone's relief.
The other one did marry the girl and it has been one train wreck after the other for them😢 but as his friend I must stand by his decision and try to be as supportive as possible.

I feel it is my duty as a friend to speak up - but once I have told them what I think I belt up and let them make their own decision.

I recently growled at a friend for not knocking some sense into me when I got involved with a butt hole. He said "well we all knew he was an azshole - we thought you would figure it out sooner!"

Love can be blind - that's why we have friends. Don't ever feel bad about speaking up Zen.

@Zen: Hey you, That's not fair to say ladies have to be straight forward but you don't regardless of your justification you are expecting honesty from others but you are not expecting it from yourself. Yes, It's a different situation but the same bottom line: people lying to benefit themselves.

In life we can only control ourselves not others. I really believe that life is what we make it and that we need to really try to own up to our actions and go forward from there instead of finding outside blame. While a choice we make might be influenced by someone else's actions, ultimately we still used our own free will to make that choice and landed ourselves where we've ended up.

Why put the solution to your problem in the hands of others? (If more ladies would be honest I'd be able to approach them)
At the end of it all it's not a female's dishonesty getting in your way. You are getting in your way by choosing to limit yourself from taking risks because a favourable outcome is not guaranteed. I understand though because I also choose to stick with my comfort zone at times but I have no doubt that I can only look to myself for why I am where I am even if I don't like how things are sometimes.

@Zen,

You being up some interesting points. First impressions are important, but why let the "Hester Prynn" syndrome, ruin a potentially good evening? Who cares what the others think. I understand one wants to make a good impression, but eventually the truth will come out (the other side of the story) why not let the girl you are out with decide for herself what she wants to believe about you?

That's a tricky situation in giving your opinion about your friends S/O. On one hand, you risk losing the friendship, and on the other, you can only hope they respect/trust your opinon enough to take it into consideration. I am sorry it did not work out in your favor. I do agree with RNAP about not feeling bad for speaking up.....that is what a TRUE friend does (IMO) Personally, I would want a friend to do that for me. Sometimes we need a knot yanked out of our arse! 😛