Cajunspirit
@Cajunspirit
17 Years1,000+ PostsVirgo
Comments: 3 · Posts: 4208 · Topics: 163
Virgo's Conditional Love
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Posted by Cajunspirit
I read somewhere... that the love of a Virgo is conditional and I would have to agree.
Unconditional Love just sounds like a recipe for lots of suffering and pain.
As a Virgo, I am pedantic and I believe in being true to my principles and beliefs!
Why should any logical person submit themselves to accepting less than they feel they deserve?
Why should a woman who has that conviction that drinking excessively is unhealthy, undesired and foolish love a man who drinks too much?
Why should a man who believes in living healthy love a woman who smokes?
It just doesn't make sense...
I would feel so jaded and conquered if I give in my beliefs, yet I am sure many of you would say love is worth it... sigh.
Because people have different views of wat loves mean or how i like to put it they're version of it.
love means you don't use people for your benefit and selfishness love is positive thing but the word is twisted nowadays any so who knows how a person feels about people.
I think perhaps it depends on the conditions. I can totally relate to wanting someone that ticks all of the boxes and meets with predetermined specifications, but that said, when you meat someone who you click with it isn't usually because they tick the boxes, it's because of chemistry, and once that happens you can't help but forgive them their imperfections.
I imagined that my next partner would be a 5'1" brunette with no commitments. Instead I've fallen for a 5'7" blonde who has a daughter and a hectic working life... and do you know something? I couldn't care less. What I think I've learned is that perfection isn't a form with the boxes ticked, it's a feeling.
I imagined that my next partner would be a 5'1" brunette with no commitments. Instead I've fallen for a 5'7" blonde who has a daughter and a hectic working life... and do you know something? I couldn't care less. What I think I've learned is that perfection isn't a form with the boxes ticked, it's a feeling.
Posted by Cajunspirit
I read somewhere... that the love of a Virgo is conditional and I would have to agree.
Unconditional Love just sounds like a recipe for lots of suffering and pain.
As a Virgo, I am pedantic and I believe in being true to my principles and beliefs!
Why should any logical person submit themselves to accepting less than they feel they deserve?
Why should a woman who has that conviction that drinking excessively is unhealthy, undesired and foolish love a man who drinks too much?
Why should a man who believes in living healthy love a woman who smokes?
It just doesn't make sense...
I would feel so jaded and conquered if I give in my beliefs, yet I am sure many of you would say love is worth it... sigh.
I completely agree with this. I think many times people settle and compromise not for the sake of raw and pure LOVE but b/c of other selfish reasons. Like not wanting to be alone. Or not realizing that they are worthy of someone who can meet the standards that they set, which is not indicative of selfishness but low self esteem.
i practice unconditional love every moment of my life. it is not about pain or suffering. the pain and suffering experienced eludes to the person expecting reciprocation. to understand the concept of unconditional love u must let go of ur traditional beliefs. all the love u need comes from within. we often expect others to give us love in order to receive validation of our worth. in the end we are always disappointed. we place too much responsibility on others to create our happiness. it is always a gift when others love us but to idealize it and thus adding too much emphasis is certainly folly. i find that setting my love free is a most gratifying way to live my life. i don't think it is for everyone but i operate at my best this way.
Legendary Virgo, I completely agree.
VirgoM20, do you remember your days of operating with the form in mind?
I just find it such an internal struggle to cope with things that go against my core beliefs. It is hard, very hard.
BelleTheScorpio, I understand what you are saying... but it for reference sake, I am referring to people who ARE in a relationship and love unconditionally. To completely give up yourself... it just sounds like madness to my logic driven mind.
Natural25, haha, I am happy you agree with me sweetie. However, the older folks here lead me to believe that sooner or later we all "give in" and "submit".... compromise... urgh....
ninjamu, I am happy you are able to do this... however, I am afraid that being a Virgo makes this even more difficult for me.
Virgos need to feel needed and appreciation drives us forward, keeps us happy.
Acquiring your level of emotional maturity seems beyond my grasp.
VirgoM20, do you remember your days of operating with the form in mind?
I just find it such an internal struggle to cope with things that go against my core beliefs. It is hard, very hard.
BelleTheScorpio, I understand what you are saying... but it for reference sake, I am referring to people who ARE in a relationship and love unconditionally. To completely give up yourself... it just sounds like madness to my logic driven mind.
Natural25, haha, I am happy you agree with me sweetie. However, the older folks here lead me to believe that sooner or later we all "give in" and "submit".... compromise... urgh....
ninjamu, I am happy you are able to do this... however, I am afraid that being a Virgo makes this even more difficult for me.
Virgos need to feel needed and appreciation drives us forward, keeps us happy.
Acquiring your level of emotional maturity seems beyond my grasp.
hikoro, can you really unconditionally love someone who is destroying themselves with smoking and alcohol and let them do it without a word?
Posted by ninjamu
i practice unconditional love every moment of my life. it is not about pain or suffering. the pain and suffering experienced eludes to the person expecting reciprocation. to understand the concept of unconditional love u must let go of ur traditional beliefs. all the love u need comes from within. we often expect others to give us love in order to receive validation of our worth. in the end we are always disappointed. we place too much responsibility on others to create our happiness. it is always a gift when others love us but to idealize it and thus adding too much emphasis is certainly folly. i find that setting my love free is a most gratifying way to live my life. i don't think it is for everyone but i operate at my best this way.
DITTO!!!! Very nice ninjamu!
Posted by ninjamu
i practice unconditional love every moment of my life. it is not about pain or suffering. the pain and suffering experienced eludes to the person expecting reciprocation. to understand the concept of unconditional love u must let go of ur traditional beliefs. all the love u need comes from within. we often expect others to give us love in order to receive validation of our worth. in the end we are always disappointed. we place too much responsibility on others to create our happiness. it is always a gift when others love us but to idealize it and thus adding too much emphasis is certainly folly. i find that setting my love free is a most gratifying way to live my life. i don't think it is for everyone but i operate at my best this way.
I also agree with this. Lol. So, now it comes down to what is one's definition of uncoditional love? Cajun commented on loving someone even if they have characteristics that a person is not necesarily compatible with for the sake of love. To me, that is a recipe for disater. But I do agree with you in that people do place way too much responsibility in other's as far as their happiness. Also, expectations are often what hurts...or broken expectations. But i also realize how HARD it is to live life without expectations. Expectations of others and expectations of ourselves.
Posted by Cajunspirit
Legendary Virgo, I completely agree.
VirgoM20, do you remember your days of operating with the form in mind?
I just find it such an internal struggle to cope with things that go against my core beliefs. It is hard, very hard.
BelleTheScorpio, I understand what you are saying... but it for reference sake, I am referring to people who ARE in a relationship and love unconditionally. To completely give up yourself... it just sounds like madness to my logic driven mind.
Natural25, haha, I am happy you agree with me sweetie. However, the older folks here lead me to believe that sooner or later we all "give in" and "submit".... compromise... urgh....
ninjamu, I am happy you are able to do this... however, I am afraid that being a Virgo makes this even more difficult for me.
Virgos need to feel needed and appreciation drives us forward, keeps us happy.
Acquiring your level of emotional maturity seems beyond my grasp.
no prob bro u know how Virgos do its being real u kno how it is lol
Good evening to all of you,
i'v just thinking that forum has been quiet out of late and now i'm pleasantly surprized with the beginning:-) ...
Sorry i failed to drow the white flag and a dove :-) -honestlly and for my shame hid myself being under such crossfire ....
Bad omens once again.....will not do anything good.....
peace
i'v just thinking that forum has been quiet out of late and now i'm pleasantly surprized with the beginning:-) ...
Sorry i failed to drow the white flag and a dove :-) -honestlly and for my shame hid myself being under such crossfire ....
Bad omens once again.....will not do anything good.....
peace
Posted by hikoro
Yes, I can Cajun. I have after all.
But for this to happen, you have to diminish your ego and stop seeing your loved one as an extension of yourself and your egoself.
And also work on self-acceptance in order to accept others.
Haha, I love how simple and easy you put it.
Cajun, do you have any scorpio placements in your natal chart?
What sign rules your 5th house? I know that you have cap in your 7th house.
I am very intrigued that you are attracted to scorpios so much.
Thanks.
click to expand
Um... the generated Natal chart I have says Taurus in 5th house and Cancer in 7th. I have very little Scorpio, 2 maybe 3 placements.
From what I have observed amongst all my Virgo friends, all the men are completely attracted to Scorpio women, without fail.
Natural25, life without expectations seems like a tall order to me. I have too much pride to give in, for the while.
i had a fomer Scorpio employee wen i had ma job she was a marker and a cookiemonster just flat out nasty attitude Cj dats some virgos
i like Gemini, Libra, Taurus, Capricorn, Leo, Aries women
i love they're spirit so freedom loving and cool.
Posted by hikoro
Well, I understand caring for someone who has an alcoholic problem, however, if you wish that person to change, then you are basing this desire on self-interest and self-interest is selfish love, not unconditional love.
I hope this was clearer.
I am well aware I do not exhibit unconditional love. However, being who I am, I can not and will not tolerate anyone who destroys themselves. I don't think I am selfish for wanting that.
Posted by LeGendary ViRGo
i had a fomer Scorpio employee wen i had ma job she was a marker and a cookiemonster just flat out nasty attitude Cj dats some virgos
click to expand
Yeah holmes, I read about your distaste for them before. Some do have that potential and it's because we Virgos can see right through it and call them out on their crap, that they like us.
Who knows, one might be headed your way and catch you by surprise 😛
Posted by CajunspiritPosted by hikoro
Well, I understand caring for someone who has an alcoholic problem, however, if you wish that person to change, then you are basing this desire on self-interest and self-interest is selfish love, not unconditional love.
I hope this was clearer.
I am well aware I do not exhibit unconditional love. However, being who I am, I can not and will not tolerate anyone who destroys themselves. I don't think I am selfish for wanting that.
Posted by LeGendary ViRGo
i had a fomer Scorpio employee wen i had ma job she was a marker and a cookiemonster just flat out nasty attitude Cj dats some virgos
Yeah holmes, I read about your distaste for them before. Some do have that potential and it's because we Virgos can see right through it and call them out on their crap, that they like us.
Who knows, one might be headed your way and catch you by surprise 😛click to expand
yea i'm running lmao if its a Libra girl I'm running to her arms lmao
I think it's about loving and learning to accept someone for who they are, and just let them be that. Don't you think that trying to change someone is wrong? I do...Don't forget also, you're young and many of the people in your peer group will be in an immature and destructive phase of their lives...They'll grow up alot more in 3 - 5 years 🙂
I tend to look for the lessons from my interactions with others, and be glad for those experiences and gifts that have come from it. It is an opportunity to grow... You can care from a distance - Loving another doesn't have to mean allowing yourself to be drawn into activities / situations that you don't want to be part of.
Perhaps, try to think of it as if someone else was discussing you in this way...How would it make you feel if people said "i can't love or care for you, because you're too (whatever) "— ...Other people tolerate things about you that probably drive them up the wall, but they tolerate it anyway because overall you are worth it and they care about you & value you...Isn't that beautiful?
Remember, no one's perfect - not even you. That doesn't mean that we all don't deserve to love and be loved. Everyone has their lessons to learn, and their own path to walk in life...Sooner or later, you'll find the balance that works for you 🙂
I tend to look for the lessons from my interactions with others, and be glad for those experiences and gifts that have come from it. It is an opportunity to grow... You can care from a distance - Loving another doesn't have to mean allowing yourself to be drawn into activities / situations that you don't want to be part of.
Perhaps, try to think of it as if someone else was discussing you in this way...How would it make you feel if people said "i can't love or care for you, because you're too (whatever) "— ...Other people tolerate things about you that probably drive them up the wall, but they tolerate it anyway because overall you are worth it and they care about you & value you...Isn't that beautiful?
Remember, no one's perfect - not even you. That doesn't mean that we all don't deserve to love and be loved. Everyone has their lessons to learn, and their own path to walk in life...Sooner or later, you'll find the balance that works for you 🙂
Posted by sortilege85
It got me thinking constantly and it began to make me doubt everything I once use to believe because I didn't have much experience life that everything that i considered right and pure was wrong which cause me much suffering,
Without my beliefs... I am nothing.
but a great key for the virgo man to understand, grow and accept all that will harm you is venturing into those that you despise or have an anathema. If you can't handle then don't. There are other ways to accept.
Well I most certainly can not handle people destroying themselves.
Much like hikoro, i began to accept, even my closest friend who turned to drugs, their choice of life because it makes them happy, and i can't stop that, but i do visit them often and make them laugh. Life isn't always ment to be taken seriously.
But it's wrong! Doesn't that mean anything to you? Don't you want to help them?
Evil wins when good men do nothing and they submit and accept wrong!
Posted by oddball73
I think it's about loving and learning to accept someone for who they are, and just let them be that. Don't you think that trying to change someone is wrong? I do...Don't forget also, you're young and many of the people in your peer group will be in an immature and destructive phase of their lives...They'll grow up alot more in 3 - 5 years 🙂
No I don't think it is wrong, as long as the person is healthier, wiser and better from it.
What is there to love about alcoholism, smoking, lung cancer, cirrhosis of the liver, diabetes?!
Tell me!
Perhaps, try to think of it as if someone else was discussing you in this way...How would it make you feel if people said "i can't love or care for you, because you're too (whatever) "— ...
I would listen to what they have to say, contemplate it and see how I could better myself.
Other people tolerate things about you that probably drive them up the wall, but they tolerate it anyway because overall you are worth it and they care about you & value you...Isn't that beautiful?click to expand
I don't ask nor expect them to tolerate me. People who do bad things expect you to tolerate their vices.
ithink its more live and let live people are gonna be wat they are regardless so as long as u do ur part by telling them good things den u did ur part its up to dem to make their choice its all on dem by u going outta ur way to help is great but sometimes like a tell people let them fall if they continue but they will grow up wen its times all u can do is hope for tha best and keep it moving. keep it trillz
I feel you Legendary, but I'm a man who can't sit back and watch people do dumb crap.
I hunger for justice, virtue and righteousness.
I hunger for justice, virtue and righteousness.
sortilege85, sounds like we are on the same page 🙂
Posted by tuscan_sun
I have an uncle who is a Virgo and he is married to a Sagittarius. They have been married for about 30 years now with 4 children. Almost everyone in the barrio loves my aunt and uncle, because they always help as much as they could. My uncle is a smoker, for more than 30 years. Is he destroying himself? He sure is killing his lungs and more susceptible of getting cancer.
Yes, he is destroying himself. He is cutting down his lifespan and as you stated increasing his chances for lung cancer.
Well this is an amazing example, because it more or less is the same thing I am going through, minus the time frame.
I tire of my Sag woman smoking. She lied in the beginning said she doesn't do it. Then smoked in front of me when she got jealous a time. She said she is trying to quit, but I don't see any real effort.
She revealed to me she has been doing it in secret these past few months, so she has been lying about it being habitual. Seeing as I always asked if she smoked recently.
I have both love and deep affection for her.
It pains me to know she does what she does. It annoys me. It aggravates me. It makes me furiously angry.
It goes against my principles and beliefs to smoke.
It pains me to know she does what she does. It annoys me. It aggravates me. It makes me furiously angry.
It goes against my principles and beliefs to smoke.
Posted by tuscan_sun
Are you trying to tackle down that feeling, to make it shut up because YOU REFUSE TO LOVE UNCONDITIONALLY AND IT GOES AGAINST YOUR ENTIRE BEING. Computer overload.
Pretty much.
How does she treat you?click to expand
She treats me great, this is the last imperfection I want gone.
Haha, that lil girl has so much attitude 🙂
Cajun --
I used to smoke in my 20s, but stopped when I got pregnant. Then started for a bit thereafter, but then completely stopped ever since. People MAY change habits. If you force things onto your partner, you only encourage them for secrecy.
Relationships are workable when compromises can be made.
However, I believe when you love enough, you will make those compromises.
Then again...
When in my 20s, I had a rule for myself: Never marry a guy who drinks!
I refused further envolvement with a boyfriend, because I saw him drunk one day. We were seriously thinking of marrying. One day, I saw him drinking down a gallon of whiskey among 3 people. His father used to be a heavy drinker too. It was very sudden that I lost my respect for him. I broke up the next day.
Today I am thinking that perhaps I didn't love him enough to accept his habit. Actually I am happy that I didn't end up with him. But later in my life, I married an alcoholic. I didn't know in the beginning. He tried to accomodate me by cutting down his drinking. There was constant struggle be it emotionally or financially. The end result is that his habit greatly affected our relationship.
However, alcohol is a different story than cigarette smoking. It is more difficult to be around an alcoholic compared to a smoker.
It is a decision you have to make for yourself, cajun. That is, will you follow your principles or your heart?
I used to smoke in my 20s, but stopped when I got pregnant. Then started for a bit thereafter, but then completely stopped ever since. People MAY change habits. If you force things onto your partner, you only encourage them for secrecy.
Relationships are workable when compromises can be made.
However, I believe when you love enough, you will make those compromises.
Then again...
When in my 20s, I had a rule for myself: Never marry a guy who drinks!
I refused further envolvement with a boyfriend, because I saw him drunk one day. We were seriously thinking of marrying. One day, I saw him drinking down a gallon of whiskey among 3 people. His father used to be a heavy drinker too. It was very sudden that I lost my respect for him. I broke up the next day.
Today I am thinking that perhaps I didn't love him enough to accept his habit. Actually I am happy that I didn't end up with him. But later in my life, I married an alcoholic. I didn't know in the beginning. He tried to accomodate me by cutting down his drinking. There was constant struggle be it emotionally or financially. The end result is that his habit greatly affected our relationship.
However, alcohol is a different story than cigarette smoking. It is more difficult to be around an alcoholic compared to a smoker.
It is a decision you have to make for yourself, cajun. That is, will you follow your principles or your heart?
Posted by FUMRedFairy_tales
Cajun --
However, I believe when you love enough, you will make those compromises.
I dislike this thinking.
Who loves you more honestly?
The man who stays with you and lets you destroy yourself?
Or the man who leaves after being frustrated through trying to get you to stop?
However, alcohol is a different story than cigarette smoking. It is more difficult to be around an alcoholic compared to a smoker.
There is no difference for me.
It is a decision you have to make for yourself, cajun. That is, will you follow your principles or your heart?
click to expand
Well here in lies the battle a Virgo has to go through in their life, right?
Mind versus Heart... I don't like it.
tuscan_sun, she is a Sag, they don't like being told what to do. What makes it worse is the number of health issues she has been favoured by God to get through, yet she still persists in this self destruction.
It only makes me more angry.
sometimes you get 90-something year olds who have smoked all their lives and the guy they were married to didn't last that long. If you aske the person, what do you think the reason is for your long life... she may say: SMOKING!
Yes there is a difference between alcohol and smoking. I understand not for you. What I also know about Virgos is that they can get control freaks. Not sure if they like admitting that.
Yes there is a difference between alcohol and smoking. I understand not for you. What I also know about Virgos is that they can get control freaks. Not sure if they like admitting that.
Posted by tuscan_sunPosted by CajunspiritPosted by FUMRedFairy_tales
Cajun --
However, I believe when you love enough, you will make those compromises.
I dislike this thinking.
Who loves you more honestly?
The man who stays with you and lets you destroy yourself?
Or the man who leaves after being frustrated through trying to get you to stop?
However, alcohol is a different story than cigarette smoking. It is more difficult to be around an alcoholic compared to a smoker.
There is no difference for me.
It is a decision you have to make for yourself, cajun. That is, will you follow your principles or your heart?
Well here in lies the battle a Virgo has to go through in their life, right?
Mind versus Heart... I don't like it.
tuscan_sun, she is a Sag, they don't like being told what to do. What makes it worse is the number of health issues she has been favoured by God to get through, yet she still persists in this self destruction.
It only makes me more angry.
There's the indirect approach. Think outside the box DUDEEE. Honestly, I use to be a smoker for at least a year. My doctor told me that I can get cervical cancer if I don't stop smoking because of the high concentration of chemicals they use in cigarettes. Sags can be told what to do indirectly, they are a pretty smart bunch. You just have to give them space.click to expand
my nephew is a sag and a hard headed one too i use to tell him stop drinking and smoking and being around negative people u think he listened to me or my other fam members not a chance sags are people dat have to learn thru exp u cant change them u kno wat dats wat makes me different from other virgos i dont try to change people i give to advice and if they dont listen dats on them ima let live type of person.
i would like to give a shout out to my aqua rising mercury in libra and venus in libra and moon in leo for making so easy going and a joy to be around.
Posted by LearusPosted by Cajunspirit
I read somewhere... that the love of a Virgo is conditional and I would have to agree.
Unconditional Love just sounds like a recipe for lots of suffering and pain.
As a Virgo, I am pedantic and I believe in being true to my principles and beliefs!
Why should any logical person submit themselves to accepting less than they feel they deserve?
Why should a woman who has that conviction that drinking excessively is unhealthy, undesired and foolish love a man who drinks too much?
Why should a man who believes in living healthy love a woman who smokes?
It just doesn't make sense...
I would feel so jaded and conquered if I give in my beliefs, yet I am sure many of you would say love is worth it... sigh.
Very well said.
Someone looking for unconditional love is just a treetrunked excuse for a person to not discipline themselves. You should not have to put up with someone who smokes and you don't. You should not have to put up with someone who cheats while you remain faithful. You should not have to put up with someone who is selfish while you remain caring.
You should hold onto your principles and beliefs, and not have to sacrifice them for the sake of love. If you sacrifice yourself for a principle, what have you become? You won't even know. You'll go through one identity crisis after the next because of conflicting principles and beliefs, and no love on earth is worth that.click to expand
i like u ur very intelligence and profound and ur right about ur statment u cant help dat dont wanna be help geezzzzzzzzzzz lmao
Posted by tuscan_sun
People sacrifice a lot of things for love.
Big question was tha love real or a illusion as many people mistake dat as love in live in bliss lmao
or is it worth all that pain and stress dat can be detrimental to ur life.
Learus, happy you and Legendary share my views. I'm usually alone on my stand points.
tuscan_sun, the age old say is, you can't love someone if you can't love yourself. So if someone is good at making a fool of themself, destroying themself through drugs, smoking and alcohol, they sure as hell could do the same to you.
tuscan_sun, the age old say is, you can't love someone if you can't love yourself. So if someone is good at making a fool of themself, destroying themself through drugs, smoking and alcohol, they sure as hell could do the same to you.
Posted by Cajunspirit
Learus, happy you and Legendary share my views. I'm usually alone on my stand points.
tuscan_sun, the age old say is, you can't love someone if you can't love yourself. So if someone is good at making a fool of themself, destroying themself through drugs, smoking and alcohol, they sure as hell could do the same to you.
well i'ma virgo too u kno lmao
Posted by LearusPosted by Cajunspirit
Learus, happy you and Legendary share my views. I'm usually alone on my stand points.
tuscan_sun, the age old say is, you can't love someone if you can't love yourself. So if someone is good at making a fool of themself, destroying themself through drugs, smoking and alcohol, they sure as hell could do the same to you.
Well you're not alone anymore. You're right, you have to love yourself before you can love someone else. Destroying yourself for whatever reason, is not self-love. You're right about someone destroying you through influence. It's also been said "misery loves company". So true.click to expand
awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww lmao
but ur rite
Posted by tuscan_sun
Smoking is different from alcohol and drugs. Alcohol and drugs you are under the influence, therefore losing one's inhibition.click to expand
You're right it is different. You're under no influence, but you still choose to do something bad for your health. Which makes it worse, in my honest opinion.
Posted by tuscan_sun
Just because someone smokes it doesn't mean he/she has no love for him/herself. I know this is going against what I said earlier, but people do have their bad habits- a little selfishness. It doesn't mean there's no love.
Someday someday.
Live, laugh & through it one may find the meaning of love.
'
A little selfishness? A LOT of selfishness.
Smoking benefits no one. All it does is piss off those who care about you and destroy your lungs.
The only person who gets anything out of it, is yourself and you do so at the cost of your health and concern of those who care about you.
It is a sign of weak character, poor discipline and pathetic problem solving. No excuses.
Posted by Rumi
seriously cajun, i personally think you are not in love, when you cant live with imperfections and have conditions that apply..
Every compatibility article I have read clearly state that Virgos and Sagittarius both have incredibly different views on love. So it's only natural for you to think so.
Posted by Rumi
ok.. there you go.. hid the post..
you obviously dont need a sag perspective on things.
fine.
You did not have to... nor was it something I wanted.
It is you who has been extremely insightful to me in the past about these issues and from you I have calibrated my understanding, for that I am very grateful.
Your perspective is no different from hers.
Posted by satori
Cajun, you just need to shut up already and decide if you can handle your Sags habits or not.
Excuse me? I'm sorry but I thought this was a forum for sharing thoughts and experiences. Why do you want me to shut up?
But you just have to know your limits and make a decision. As it stands you are in conflict and I'm sure you're judging is pissing off your Sag.
I have my limits too. I personally will not have a relationship with a man who is a part of any organized religion, especially Christianity. For, I find it to be the most hateful, self-destructive, soul-killing belief system known to man.
So it's wrong for me to judge her smoking and right for you to judge men because of their religion?
And unconditional love does not mean that you will accept anything from a partner, but that you will love them no matter what.
That sounds like a towering contradiction.
You may not decide to be with them as a partner if they are taking a path you don't believe in, but you can still be there for them and always love them.
Condoning evil is Supporting evil. There are no two ways about it.
She can only do what seems right to her, not to you, and vice versa.click to expand
So children should have no guidance either, right?
If a child wants to cut themselves with a knife, because they believe it is "right for them" we should allow it! Gotcha!
I only ask of her what is scientifically proven to be a healthy and wise choice.
Posted by mountain_and_sea
"I only ask of her what is scientifically proven to be a healthy and wise choice."
Are you saying that people should reduce their lives into fitting a proven-to-be-healthy scientific mold?
Sure, it's a logical thought, but people aren't always logical, and why should they be expected to be? It's not in our nature to be perfect. I know it's hard to accept, but it's the truth.
Yes, it is. To unconditionally love someone, however, who actively destroys themselves, sounds very painful to me.
Sometimes I wonder if virgos, ot people with alot of virgo influence in their chart can ever really love another person fully. Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but seems to me like you LOOK for flaws and vices.
Here's the kicker, my chart is mostly Leo and Sagittarius. Funny how that works aye?
So what if she smoke? Sure, it's bad, and you??re right - if you love somebody you WILL be worried about them. You can even break up with them. But to stop LOVING them just because they destroy themselves is not possible. In that case - you never really loved them in the first place.click to expand
I am in complete accord.
However, my argument is... if you love someone unconditionally who intentionally and consciously destroys themselves without taking action to prevent from doing so... what kind of love is that, honestly?
It's just like accepting defeat and hoping your victor does the right thing... oh crap now it really is starting to sound like love... ugh!
Posted by tuscan_sun
--What kind of love is that for who—
The person who is not troubled by the self destruction of the one they love.
Posted by Cajunspirit
I feel you Legendary, but I'm a man who can't sit back and watch people do dumb crap.
I hunger for justice, virtue and righteousness.
lol @ Dumb crap. I can see your point totally ^_^.
However, sometimes people have to learn things on their own. Sometimes figuring stuff out can be a learning experience, you know?
Cajun ...
I myself am a bit confused on the whole 'unconditional love' thing. If I could care for someone unconditionally, than I wouldn't have broken up with my boyfriend back in March ... there were problems there, major problems -- money issues, his sickness, his 4 (OMG!!!!) children that were all very young, his living arrangements ...
You know Cajun, my ex-boyfriend smoked but he wasn't suppose to because of his sickness ... what the hell is that— He did it because "it made him feel better" OMG! Come on man.
At first, I thought I could deal with them, but then I started putting things together and realized that he needed to someone who was willing to deal with 'all of this'. I simply got cold feet and I bailed as quick as I could once I figured out the right way to break up with him -- it took like four tries because he wanted to keep the relationship together -- he was another virgo ... nope, virgos don't like breakups.
The more I think about, the more I feel it was the right thing to do.
So yes, I see your point, although I haven't read all the posts here. To watch someone self-destruct in front is terrible. Especially when you are trying to help them before they get to that freaking point. Then they actually expect you to be there while they keep doing the same thing over and over again. For goodness sakes, it would be different if they learn from their mistakes but if they keep doing it ... then what are you suppose to do?
My goodness, I don't have the gump for all of that.
This is a good topic Cajun, I'm not sure if I can relate to how you feel but I understand where you are coming from. Hope that makes sense.
I myself am a bit confused on the whole 'unconditional love' thing. If I could care for someone unconditionally, than I wouldn't have broken up with my boyfriend back in March ... there were problems there, major problems -- money issues, his sickness, his 4 (OMG!!!!) children that were all very young, his living arrangements ...
You know Cajun, my ex-boyfriend smoked but he wasn't suppose to because of his sickness ... what the hell is that— He did it because "it made him feel better" OMG! Come on man.
At first, I thought I could deal with them, but then I started putting things together and realized that he needed to someone who was willing to deal with 'all of this'. I simply got cold feet and I bailed as quick as I could once I figured out the right way to break up with him -- it took like four tries because he wanted to keep the relationship together -- he was another virgo ... nope, virgos don't like breakups.
The more I think about, the more I feel it was the right thing to do.
So yes, I see your point, although I haven't read all the posts here. To watch someone self-destruct in front is terrible. Especially when you are trying to help them before they get to that freaking point. Then they actually expect you to be there while they keep doing the same thing over and over again. For goodness sakes, it would be different if they learn from their mistakes but if they keep doing it ... then what are you suppose to do?
My goodness, I don't have the gump for all of that.
This is a good topic Cajun, I'm not sure if I can relate to how you feel but I understand where you are coming from. Hope that makes sense.
Posted by cappysweetie
So yes, I see your point, although I haven't read all the posts here. To watch someone self-destruct in front is terrible. Especially when you are trying to help them before they get to that freaking point. Then they actually expect you to be there while they keep doing the same thing over and over again. For goodness sakes, it would be different if they learn from their mistakes but if they keep doing it ... then what are you suppose to do?
EXACTLY!!!
Should you grow fed up of their non sense and make a stand.
"Oh you don't love me enough!"
"You're trying to change me for who I am!"
"You can't accept me for my faults!"
Blah blah blah... If your friend was drowning and they told you they wanted to drown, would you let them?
It is STUPID and POINTLESS to continue to support through your love someone who is DESTROYING themself and clearly demonstrate their lack of SELF LOVE.
That doesn't mean you stop loving them, so don't get that twisted.
This is a good topic Cajun, I'm not sure if I can relate to how you feel but I understand where you are coming from. Hope that makes sense.click to expand
I am more than happy with your contribution cappysweetie, thank you ever so kindly.
Posted by CajunspiritPosted by cappysweetie
So yes, I see your point, although I haven't read all the posts here. To watch someone self-destruct in front is terrible. Especially when you are trying to help them before they get to that freaking point. Then they actually expect you to be there while they keep doing the same thing over and over again. For goodness sakes, it would be different if they learn from their mistakes but if they keep doing it ... then what are you suppose to do?
EXACTLY!!!
Should you grow fed up of their non sense and make a stand.
"Oh you don't love me enough!"
"You're trying to change me for who I am!"
"You can't accept me for my faults!"
Blah blah blah... If your friend was drowning and they told you they wanted to drown, would you let them?
It is STUPID and POINTLESS to continue to support through your love someone who is DESTROYING themself and clearly demonstrate their lack of SELF LOVE.
That doesn't mean you stop loving them, so don't get that twisted.
This is a good topic Cajun, I'm not sure if I can relate to how you feel but I understand where you are coming from. Hope that makes sense.
I am more than happy with your contribution cappysweetie, thank you ever so kindly.click to expand
Not a problem, I see where you are coming from. I also really 'get' what you are saying. I didn't think you were being cold-hearted. Constant-self-destructive-behavior isn't for everyone. Some people can put up with it and others don't like being bothered. It doesn't make those who don't want to deal with it bad people, it just means that its not within their tolerance level.
I know this isn't about me, its about you ... but I don't have the mind to deal with someone who keeps on doing stuff over and over and over again. Its like, "I've tried to help you once and I've tried to help you twice. When are you going to love me enough to actually do something about this problem you have? Its obvious that I love you enough to keep helping you, how long do I have to put up with this?"
So yeah, I guess I'm the same way on that front, but that just doesn't go for boyfriends, it goes for friends and family too really.
Posted by tuscan_sun
I ready the topic again and your first post.
So, what if the person does it occasionally, just like people do drink on occasion. Would that be tolerable?
Cappysweetie, answered this for me.
Posted by cappysweetie
Some people can put up with it and others don't like being bothered. It doesn't make those who don't want to deal with it bad people, it just means that its not within their tolerance level.
I know this isn't about me, its about you ... but I don't have the mind to deal with someone who keeps on doing stuff over and over and over again. Its like, "I've tried to help you once and I've tried to help you twice. When are you going to love me enough to actually do something about this problem you have? Its obvious that I love you enough to keep helping you, how long do I have to put up with this?"
So yeah, I guess I'm the same way on that front, but that just doesn't go for boyfriends, it goes for friends and family too really.click to expand
I treat everyone the same.
I can tolerate mild drinking but smoking is a hell no.
I can tolerate mild drinking but smoking is a hell no.
Hahaha... I agree, but the way you put it cracks me up "is a hell no" lol nice
Posted by VirLeogurl09
Hahaha... I agree, but the way you put it cracks me up "is a hell no" lol nice
Always pleasing to learn I made someone smile 🙂
Posted by CajunspiritPosted by tuscan_sun
I ready the topic again and your first post.
So, what if the person does it occasionally, just like people do drink on occasion. Would that be tolerable?
Cappysweetie, answered this for me.
Posted by cappysweetie
Some people can put up with it and others don't like being bothered. It doesn't make those who don't want to deal with it bad people, it just means that its not within their tolerance level.
I know this isn't about me, its about you ... but I don't have the mind to deal with someone who keeps on doing stuff over and over and over again. Its like, "I've tried to help you once and I've tried to help you twice. When are you going to love me enough to actually do something about this problem you have? Its obvious that I love you enough to keep helping you, how long do I have to put up with this?"
So yeah, I guess I'm the same way on that front, but that just doesn't go for boyfriends, it goes for friends and family too really.
I treat everyone the same.
I can tolerate mild drinking but smoking is a hell no.click to expand
lol, nice to see I can be of service ^_^.
Posted by Cajunspirit
I read somewhere... that the love of a Virgo is conditional and I would have to agree.
Unconditional Love just sounds like a recipe for lots of suffering and pain.
As a Virgo, I am pedantic and I believe in being true to my principles and beliefs!
Why should any logical person submit themselves to accepting less than they feel they deserve?
Why should a woman who has that conviction that drinking excessively is unhealthy, undesired and foolish love a man who drinks too much?
Why should a man who believes in living healthy love a woman who smokes?
It just doesn't make sense...
I would feel so jaded and conquered if I give in my beliefs, yet I am sure many of you would say love is worth it... sigh.
If you really want my point of view...which you may or may not. haha. I love unconditionally. Which means I love everyone the same way. I love my mom, my dad, my best friend, my boyfriend, the homeless person on the street, the person I meet in the bus, all the same. Some people I may have a more special connection with than others because they are capable of sharing that love with me in different ways, while others simply do not love back (which is ok.) The difference between conditional and unconditional love is that when you love conditionally you really don't have the ability to fall deeply inlove but just in-like. You love someone because they have DDD chest, or they have a car/house, or because they have no kids, or only when they love you. How can you love someone based on conditions? It sounds more like you love the conditions they portray and not necessarily them. Obviously you are not going to fall inlove someone whom the first day you meet they they punch you in the face and steal your money. To fall inlove WITH someone you have to feel loved by them as well right? People change, maybe they quit smoking or popping their gum and become a better person. Maybe they don't change. However, you can love them anyway for who they are, move on with your life and fall inlove with someone else. Usually you meet someone, fall inlove, and go by the way they embody all the conditions that I have been looking for. Not the other way around. lol
Posted by sweat.lioness
To fall inlove WITH someone you have to feel loved by them as well right? People change, maybe they quit smoking or popping their gum and become a better person. Maybe they don't change. However, you can love them anyway for who they are, move on with your life and fall inlove with someone else. Usually you meet someone, fall inlove, and go by the way they embody all the conditions that I have been looking for. Not the other way around. lol
So you have no problem loving and taking care of someone, who is intentionally killing themselves and would do nothing to stop them?
Is that really love?
Posted by CajunspiritPosted by sweat.lioness
To fall inlove WITH someone you have to feel loved by them as well right? People change, maybe they quit smoking or popping their gum and become a better person. Maybe they don't change. However, you can love them anyway for who they are, move on with your life and fall inlove with someone else. Usually you meet someone, fall inlove, and go by the way they embody all the conditions that I have been looking for. Not the other way around. lol
So you have no problem loving and taking care of someone, who is intentionally killing themselves and would do nothing to stop them?
Is that really love?click to expand
Well that question really applies to everyone right? I mean there are very few people who aren't "killing themselves" every day with simple things. For instance, the obese kill themselves clogging their arteries and eating their lives away. Do pleasantly plump people not deserved to be loved as well? All these people need to do is get some gosh darn excersize and realize how truely beautiful they really are. That is REAL love. It is not love to dismiss someone or tell them that they aren't good enough for you because of the things they do. The leading cause of obesity, cigarette smoking, drinking, all these "bad" things are depression and stress. The people in the world who don't show their love and care for these people are the kind of people who make them go out and buy another pack of cigarettes. Sometimes it takes another person to show you your true beauty. (Yes it's supposed to be about self-love but it's kind of difficult when the world is working against you) I'm not trying to say that people should go down the same toilet as another to demonstrate love. I am also not trying to say that you should encourage them, throw a party and give them $ 25 dollars to buy a pack of coors light. I'm trying to say that if you really care about someone you should show them the toilet they are splish splashing in and then show them the warmth, love and the light of your life. Then ask them which they rather have. Some people decide to party in the toilet, you then have to respect their decision and go back to your own cookie cutter life. However, you would be suprized how many people would actually prefer cutting cookies after toilet partying for w
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As a Virgo, I am pedantic and I believe in being true to my principles and beliefs!
Why should any logical person submit themselves to accepting less than they feel they deserve?
Why should a woman who has that conviction that drinking excessively is unhealthy, undesired and foolish love a man who drinks too much?
Why should a man who believes in living healthy love a woman who smokes?
It just doesn't make sense...
I would feel so jaded and conquered if I give in my beliefs, yet I am sure many of you would say love is worth it... sigh.