Read between the lines (Page 4)

I think that is why I try to hold on as long as I do. I know once I turn off, no matter how much I want to have those feelings again, I never will. It is done.

He called yesterday and still calls me babe...but I feel like he calls every girl "babe" and don't want to be grouped into that.

We had a long, confusing talk last night after I got direct with him, but I still didn't the answers I so desperately needed.

I'm an over-analyzer and I'm driving myself crazy trying to figure out what's going on in his head. He thinks about me, I know this, but he has stopped trying to spend time with me as his family seems to take precedence.

I asked him if he wanted to back away. He asked me if I wanted to back away and I told him no. He said that he didn't want me to either. I asked him what kept him claiming yo be interested in me, and he said "We have two choices in life for reasons why we do things - because we want to or because we have to. And for your question, it's because I want to".

He kept analyzing what I was asking and saying and that because he's a man and I'm a woman, we see things differently. I told him that when I care for someone or I'm interested in them, I make time for him. He asked me what made me think that he didn't want to spend time with me and I told him it just appeared he wasn't trying. Then he asked since i've known him when did he not mention him doing something for his mom, dad, sisters, or brother? I told him he's always doing something for them or with them.

But the thing is he's been gone for 1 week before and just recently, 2 full weeks and his family was fine without him - so it can be done. It's so hard to ask for one day a week from him, is it? No, I don't think so. I didn't tell him that part.


OK, part of it's off my chest.

HP,

*****He asked me what made me think that he didn't want to spend time with me and I told him it just appeared he wasn't trying. Then he asked since i've known him when did he not mention him doing something for his mom, dad, sisters, or brother? I told him he's always doing something for them or with them.

This was a big problem with my ex. Libra men are most committed to their family.
Although me and our daughter was his primary family. He didn't get it even when he was told by a Paster and over again through counseling. And his mother being constantly in our business - I would give that 50% of the reason I filed for divorce.

So, now both of you listen: don't do anything for a little while. Wait it out for a bit...

You have to give us a chance to play our part which is slow, I'll admit that. But you are dealing with Libras and we need the thinking part - we can only do it the Libra way...

Go shopping!

He called me today at lunch and talked to me for about 45 minutes, mostly him helping me figure out a computer problem for my boss. When it was all said and done, he helped me figure out what to buy to fix the problem and he has offered to come up to my office to install it for us.

So my confusion lingers on. Would he help just anyone out like this or people he cares about?

Libra takes the easy way out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If we have just had an emotional session with you e.g. conversation last night or email, something confrontational and we know we want OUT then we will not spend time with you. Way too emotional.

He is putting in effort, don't you see it?

Yes, I can see it. I am still confused, dontcha know...

Go with the flow and let him sort it out for the both of you...

The more you resist, the more he will be discouraged. We're reactive...

I'm trying...

You know, one of my best friends is a Taurus. We get on like a house on fire, although we're pretty different. We shared a good sense of humour a long time ago. Very strong friendship.

She was the one friend that told me that I am a very loyal person...

Do you recognise this?

Do I recognize that he's loyal? No, not yet.

I take that back. Yes, he appears loyal to his family. But he's broken a few promises to me, small, but still promises.

Little Sparrow....are you able to elaborate regarding what the Leo said to make you change how you felt??

It'd be interesting but of course don't feel obliged if it is too personal.

HP, it's not so much keeping promises...It is loyalty towards the friendship and that he keeps coming back for it, keeps feeding it and giving it attention.

Libra and LS, just an update. Feeling good today about everything, even after the long email, as I now have expressed myself. I am actually going shopping and have a full weekend ahead.

Was just wondering one thing though: Went to the gym this morning no Libra again, he never misses a day (especially during the week) at the gym. I think he has started working out in the evening as he knows with my work schedule, that I probably won't be there, that is why I workout in the morning and we used to workout together in the morning until 1 1/2 weeks ago.

Are libra men cowardly or should I just think he doesn't want to feel uncomfortable?

I am glad in a way that I don't have to see him every morning because I think he is a little uncomfortable going through whatever he is going through. The bad thing is after the new year I won't be able to workout in the morning anymore. I will have to work out in the evening and hopefully the uncomfortableness will have resided by then.

Whatcha think?

Queen, have you spoken to him at all? There could be situations beyond his control that he hasn't been working out in the morning. Maybe he's out of town? Maybe there's been a family emergency? Maybe he's sick?

I don't think Libra men are cowards. I think you might be speculating that it has to do with you and chances are there's just extenuating circustances keeping him from the gym. Without talking to him, you really won't know for sure.

When was the last time you talked to him? I honestly cant remember what you've said...but if it's been close to 2 weeks or over, then I say it's not a bad thing to call him and see how he's doing. Or, just wait until the end of next week and call and wish him a Happy Holidays. Wish him well and reiterate to him that you're his friend and you're there for him to do whatever friends do.

"he never wanted to just be my friend. I think you are confusing me with HP. "

The Libra in my life wants more, but we've both been too chicken to take it to that level. Sorry I'm responding to this late. This post has grown so big that I totally missed this. I do think he has a fear of committment, but so do I. Will it ever work? lol 😛

I did think about that as well HP... Yet here is his email response below, so I guess we will talk. I will keep you girls posted:

"I read your email and I appreaciate you putting yourself out like that, I can definitely relate as I cherish what we have as well. However, I wasn't necessarily ignoring you in the way or reasons you may be thinking. This is probably a conversation we need to have, although I don't like having these types of conversations. I will call you later. I have a game tonight and I have to help a friend hang up some lights...

I will talk to you soon..."


My response: Thanks. I appreciate that.

I am now getting a little cowardly, because I don't know what to expect, which is out of charactor for me (Scorpio)the friendship could end or he could really have something going on or maybe he got back together with his ex. Who knows. I just want to know whats what. I look forward to it.


What do you think?

"However, I wasn't necessarily ignoring you in the way or reasons you may be thinking. This is probably a conversation we need to have, although I don't like having these types of conversations. "

It truly sounds like he is confused over the women in his life - almost like a tug of war as to what to do.

Whatever he says, he's not going to walk away from the friendship between the two of you and you've mentioned here that you're OK with that. So just try to be prepared for whatever he needs to talk to you about, but don't be emotional or detrimentally reactive to it. Absorb it and thank him for talking to you. Libras don't like confrontation, so whatever has been on his mind has been on his mind for a while and he's been contemplating a good time to talk about it.

Thanks HP,

This is where I am baffled... What women? There is his ex and there is his friend, with a little bene's - Me. Why would it be this serious. If he wants to cut the bene's it would be a damn shame, but I can swing it. His friendship is what I cherish the most. He is always helping someone. He sure helped me a lot of times, offered as I didn't even ask. I like that in him. He said his ex used to get upset about that. I think it is great. My ex would help his friends often as well. The Libra way.

By the way guys he and I have been friends since July and the benefits came in around August. So, we have built a closeness around our friendship, until now, this is weird... I think it is best we have this conversation on the phone rather than in person. It will be better for me anyway.

Houston,

Your guy has family obligations. Although they are not important to you, they are important to him. This is his pattern. Remember the car accident? He helps others in need. This is a WONDERFUL quality in a man. It shows charity, empathy, and compassion but you have to know that this will always be the way. It has NOTHING to do with you and the value he places on you. It has to do with who he is, his values, and beliefs.

When others are in need, he will put them first. He is loyal to his friends and family and will always be there for them when they need him. You either accept that or you need to reject him. If your values are different, you are not compatible and if you continue this relationship neither of you will be happy long term.

Queen

I think he believes you have expectations of him re: being more available. My feeling is he is going to cut off at least benefits if not more. He will do it in a way where he assumes all blame because that is just the way we are.

I wish you would have just rolled with it and been his friend. He is a bit of a mess and ending friendships ect. at this time will add to his stress. I have never forgiven the two people who ended their friendships with me when I was going through my break-up. I will never forgive them because had either of them called and had something bad happen to them, I would have been there. End of story. Because when people go through things, you are just there for them. You put the shit aside.

Adding fuel to someone's fire is never cool. I really think you should just be his friend and be kind to him. Forget all the shit.

Just my opinion. I know you will disagree.

clingy/needy too fast....not good.

Hey Sparrow. I never put down his family obligations and never have said they're unimportant to me. I think it's great he's there for him. I've accepted that from the start, but just because you accept doesn't mean you can't complain about it. lol...I'm just backing off so he can commit to his family and work obligations. He thinks about me, he initiates the text and phone calls, so he cares in his own way. It's frustrating, but yes, I'm patient enough to deal with it. He is coming up to my office today to help out with an issue my boss is having - I didn't ask, he offered. I know this is who he is and love that. We're commita-phobes. I won't admit that to him, and I don't think he'll ever admit it to me, but our actions are speaking for themselves. I feel he truly is becoming attached to me, so I'm just going with the flow and I will follow his lead.

Houston

To me it is obvious that he is attached to you.

You have to be honest about where you can accept his "obligations" to others for a lifetime. How will you feel 25 years from now knowing that he will feel obligated to put others first?

Only you can answer that question.

🙂

LS, I actually agree. That is what I have been saying in my previous posts... Friendship is the most important to me. The butter is just extra. I have told him this in the email as well. However, why would he want to end a friendship unless I am thinking he might getting emotional again and he can't balance the friendship and whatever else.

It seems as though you think I only want the butter and I clearly have been stating how his friendship is way more important. I can do without the butter, but it would be a shame. Trust, I have done it before and me and that guy are still friends.

I must be being ignored: I don't think he's ending your friendship. And when you talk to him tonight, tell him what you just typed: "His friendship is way more important"...he'll appreciate that. He's going through things and he doesn't expect you to relate to it but rather hopes you understand where he's coming from. The fact that he's been wanting to talk to you, he realizes there needs to be an absolution and he is fessing up to it now. They aren't confrontational, so him even mentioning to you that he needs to talk to you about it is a step he's been contemplating.

Just go with the flow

Rikely,

I agree with the both of you about the friendship thing and either I have been posting to one of the other message boards or my messages are not clear— All along I have been fine with how things were. My deal is not the butter cut off, but the friendship cut off. I only sent and email to him and I was a little worried that the party thing wasn't offensive as it shouldn't have been as we are just friends. However, that is when his actions changed.

Whatever, at this point, he is a great person and whatever he decides to do I support that. I am like that with all my friends, male and female, whether I agree or not, I will support their decisions, even if it involves me.

My email was kind of long. His was what I posted. Mine may have been a paragraph longer, as I was expressing a couple of points. Not emotional though. Mostly factual and straight forward with a couple compliments.

I do think HP gets where I am coming from more. However, again, whichever way it goes it goes. I just want to get there. I hate being in Limbo.

Rikely, how do you think I am more invested than I think? Just interested in how people percieve me, maybe I am not communicating clearly in general. Hmmmm.

We're all invested in these guys or we wouldn't have spent time creating 189 posts so far. The men that show interest in us or give us their attention, no matter how much or little, makes us think or wonder if they're "the one".

I don't dwell on the guy at Subway that makes my sandwich or my co-worker just because they're nice and helpful or attractive. Chances are you aren't going to have sex with the Subway guy or your co-worker, so those emotional attachments are an issue only with the guys we have had or want to have sex with. But once we begin trying to analyzing a specific guy's thought process or once we begin to wonder "why, when, what" of that guy, then that's the moment we begin to invest in them.

And it's not just those we want to have or have had sex with. It's with any man whom has expressed an interest in us or whom has given us attention in any manner.

Rikely he isn't just like one of my other male friends, this is true, I haven't slept with the other ones.... The other ones don't tell me initmate and personal things about their life and relationship like he does, the others don't workout with me several days a week and just hang out and talk. So the closeness is different. I cannot honestly say if my situation (recently divorced) was different I wouldn't jump at the chance to become something more with him.

I know me and I know that he is in a healing process so a relationship isn't optional as far as I am concerned. I hope to God he doesn't ask me anything like that, because I will run at this point. But looking at how things have been lately I really doubt he will.

I am emotionally attached to an extent. Not in-love and want him as my man. I know it sounds crazy right, but I perfer him there as a friend at this point.

I honestly haven't thought about it any other way. When a scorp is in a comfort zone with someone they get attached and I have just become very comfortable with him...

This is from the heart...

I totally agree that there is some emotionalism on both my side and his, just because of the way the friendship developed and ofcourse the great sex!!! So yes there is some emotional ties and bonds. HP you are right. I think any female and in some cases males want to be around a person who makes them feel special whether they plan to be with them for a long period or not.

If my feelings about the space I am in right now were different who knows what I would do. But I know what I can handle right now and things were going so well darn!! So yes, I am wishing things could stay the same without the extra emotions, pull backs etc.

If that's from the heart, does he know this?

This is the first time a need to express this has come up and yest I did include the things I am telling you guys in my email and will reinerate it whenever we talk. Which, since it looks like his evening is busy sometime this weekend? I made sure I didn't mention he looked busy and if he needed to reschedule as he might get scared or take it as rejection or something weird. I just thanked him and told him I appreciated that.

My experience has been that Libras are communicators in the verbal sense, not the written word.

"Ever since I said "as long as you communicate, are open and honest and responsive (don't ignore emails or texts) you will have a loyal friend" he always replies within minutes to my texts and a day or two with email."

Rikely, I would almost bet you the reason why he is prompt is because he fears confrontation from you if he doesn't get back with you. These guys dread confrontation and usually try to do anything to avoid confrontation, short of avoidance. It sounds almost as if you gave him an ultimatum and placed conditions on what kind of friend you'd be....almost as if you told him "If you communicate and be responsive I'll be loyal, but the moment you don't respond, I'll turn on you".

He won't disappear unless you confront the moment he doesn't communicate with you within your guidelines.

I'm not saying you do, I just said that it almost sounds like you gave an ultimatum...

seems like you did the same...

Me? I suppose I did.

I'm listening to this song right now and for some reason, it is quite fitting for QueenScorp:

Step one you say we need to talk
He walks you say sit down it's just a talk
He smiles politely back at you
You stare politely right on through
Some sort of window to your right
As he goes left and you stay right
Between the lines of fear and blame
And you begin to wonder why you came

Where did I go wrong, I lost a friend
Somewhere along in the bitterness
And I would have stayed up with you all night
Had I known how to save a life

Let him know that you know best
Cause after all you do know best
Try to slip past his defense
Without granting innocence
Lay down a list of what is wrong
The things you've told him all along
And pray to God he hears you
And pray to God he hears you

Where did I go wrong, I lost a friend
Somewhere along in the bitterness
And I would have stayed up with you all night
Had I known how to save a life

As he begins to raise his voice
You lower yours and grant him one last choice
Drive until you lose the road
Or break with the ones you've followed
He will do one of two things
He will admit to everything
Or he'll say he's just not the same
And you'll begin to wonder why you came

Where did I go wrong, I lost a friend
Somewhere along in the bitterness
And I would have stayed up with you all night
Had I known how to save a life

I like the Fray.

Wow, HP, that is scary... I guess I will be reliving the words to this song when we talk. Hopefully in a positive way. Something how you heard that song now...

Rikely you are right. He said he would call later and let me know what he has to do tonight. With a Libra later could be tonight, tomorrow or next week. I have learned that. I will be open and direct as always, whenever we talk. I mostly listen and see where he is right now. That is the most important thing to me.


HP, I hear you about what Rikely was saying, but I must agree with her on what she wants or needs in a relationship. I am the same way.. I expect all my friends and aquantances to communicate what is up. I hate being in the dark. I would rather almost leave it alone than agonize about it unless it was a really close friend. I AM GOING TO HAVE TO PRINT THAT SONG.

However HP, in the Libra world I could definitely see them taking it the way you explained.

Queenscorp

Your question "Are libra men cowardly or should I just think he doesn't want to feel uncomfortable?"

We take the easy way out when we don't know yet how we feel or need to postpone a perhaps awkward situation so yes it is possible. Not ready to talk. To illustrate this: if I am expecting to bump into someone because normally that would be the case and all of a sudden this does not happen, the first thing I'll think is 'must be avoiding me'...

I can only think that up if that is something I do myself...

Mr. Libra came up to my office today and helped out with some computer issues. He invited me out to dinner so off we went. We shared dessert with two spoons...awww...lol

I just followed his lead. He touched my face a few times, touched my hands at the restaurant. At my office, he snuck a kiss...

The guy just confuses me. I tell myself to just go with the flow and I do for the most part....but when I am apart from him, I miss him. 😢

Awww that is so cute!!! Your story gives me hope LOL

HP, the touching means that he is in love with you.

And the bit he will never let you in on is that he misses you more when you are not together. But we are not allowed to claim the other person or go onto their territory so he can never tell you...

Libra